Tonight: Kate's on the run while Jack must do something that could jeopardize the life of a friend.
So, you know, same as most episodes!
Keep your eyes peeled for at least one really interesting guest star...
Tuesday, February 09, 2010
What Kate Does - Season 6, Episode 2
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«Oldest ‹Older 401 – 491 of 491You're welcome Capcom.
I hope I can get it back soon. I think she's going to have to do a recovery which means I'll lose all my files.
She's had it a couple of days she tried one thing that didn't work. she said she would try rewriting windows over top of windows and if that didn't work she'll have to do the recovery. I haven't heard anything from her yet. The ironic thing is I bought something to back up my files and never got around to it. I know, I know. lol Live and learn.
I use my daughter's laptop when she's at school then switch to my phone after that. I think I'm going blind. lol I just hope she gets it working by Tuesday. I'll never keep up otherwise. lol
Lol - I stole the "cooties" idea from Scoutpost, so I can't take credit.
Memphish, I think you're on to something. I guess I hadn't really put any weight on either timeline being the "real" one or the "ultimate" one yet. I think they are connected and it's way too early to make assumptions about what's being shown.
Also LOL at myself - when scary Dr. Ethan said "Goodspeed", I thought of Goodwin instead and I thought Wait, What???
I hadn't ever thought of Locke and Helen having a baby, but I guess it would be possible. I wonder if they will follow up on that train of thought or not.
SG I hope you can get a reliable computer soon!
I had never seen the red tapestry before there's a link here. It also has translation of the Greek.
Thanks MadAriad for that link. I don't go to Doc's site much I afraid of getting spoiled.
Those are very interesting translations.
@ JT - when Jack takes the one vodka bottle instead of 2, I took it to simply be an indication that in this reality, he is not fated to go through the downward spiral he did throughout the series, towards alcoholism, drug abuse and self-loathing.
What I am seeing/theorizing, thus far:
I think what we're seeing in the flash sideways is the end of the series. A sideways reality that is not "bound" by the influence of the numbers and the subtle/dramatic effect is has played in the lives of each of our characters(and the world): Jack s no longer fated to become an alcoholic, Hurley is no longer cursed by them, the flight is not on Sept 23rd, the characters aren't necessarily in their "numbered" 815 seats (do we even know they were on FL815? not sure) etc etc. I think Darlton are going to be emphasising the numbers leading up to the end.
Despite not being in a "number-influenced reality, I think TPTB are showing that the lives of our key players are fated, in whatever universe they are in, to be interconnected with each other (thus far we've seen Kate/Claire, Jack/Locke)- and it is the stories of their interconnected fates that will be played out to the end of the series.
I'm with JT on the vodka bottle. Jack didn't become a drunk until he left the island and tried to deny his destiny.
I'm sure it was a typo but flight 815 was 9/22 not 9/23.
I agree with you though that the characters are destined to be intertwined regardless of where or when they are.
I've never felt that either reality was influenced by the numbers. Hurley wax the only one influenced by them in his belief that they were cursed. I know Sam Toomey and Leonard heard them and they believed they were cursed. Danielle and her crew heard them and after hearing Hurley's story she felt maybe they could be cursed.
Yes, Desmond not entering them caused 815 to crash. But I don't see them being an influence in everything that happened to the Losties. I think the only influence in the crash time line is Jacob and MIB.
Well it took me so long to type that JT deleted (I don't know her/his) post. I was agreeing that Jack was only given one vodka because he wouldn't need the other to clean his wound.
Hi SG- it's her. I don't think the post is deleted- it's awhile back. I think that the not becoming an alcoholic may be another symbolic meaning of the one bottle- along with being a clue that things are different on this flight and Jack not needing the vodka for the island since there's no island. A little change with a lot of meaning.
Still conjecture as to where they are going with the two versus one vodka bottle. We shall see. But I disagree that Jack just 'became a drunk' when he left the island. I definitely agree that he reached his tipping point when he left, but I think the seeds were sown long before.
Yes typo on the 9/22 part. Ironically you actually cite clues that he numbers very definitely do, and have been an, influence on reality. Hurley wasn't simply imagining his curse. I think the numbers have been hinted as having subtly or less subtly nudging our players lives towards the crash timeline. Not disagreeing that Jacob/MIB had anything to do with that timeline, but the numbers factor into and influence it as a whole somehow, IMO. Those ideas dont have to be mutually exclusive.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but hasn't it already been established outside the show (and therefore I'm not sure if it canon or not),that the numbers are part of a sequence or bellweather as to humanity's fate?
I agree with that statement, JT. Especially "a little change with a lot of meaning."
JT
I thought you were a she but didn't want to say it and be wrong. ;)
I agree that they are littlle changes with big meanings.
Another little change with a big meaning is the title...'What Kate Does', which is in stark contrast to 'What Kate Did'. The latter implies WHH...the former implies a blank slate.
What is WHH?
Whatever happened happened.
@futureself, wait, I figured it out, What happened, happened.
You could take the title What Kate Does two ways though. It's both the present tense form of What Kate Did, and it's also (This is} what Kate does. This is who she is. Running away? That's just what Kate does.
Yes, but it's about perspective. When we see what Kate did we judged. she had already been condemned.
But in 'What Kate Did', we see her caring for what happens to Claire, almost over her own self preservation. But this is not new. She has shown similar altruistic behavior before. Now helping Cassidy back in 'Left Behind' could arguably be seen as her avoiding trouble. The guy at the petrol station was going to call the police after all which would spell disaster for Kate. But couple that with Kate's actions when choosing to shoot Jason, her partner in crime, in the leg to stop him from hurting the hostages, and choosing to help Farmer Ray when her is hurt in the truck accident, after she discovers he sold her out to Mars, thus sacrificing her escape and we see that she can be altruistic by nature. Indeed one could argue her fugitive status was down to the one act of inherent altruism - to protect her mother. There is only one bond stronger than that and that is the mother's instincts to protect her child.
And thus the curve appears to be forming itself back into a circle again...Kate on the Island in 2007 tells Sawyer that she hoped he would help her find Claire so that 'all of this wouldn't have been for nothing'. Kate was Aaron's mother for 3 years. There is such an unbreakable bond there that even Timeline B Kate is drawn to.
You might argue that this episode is just about Kate on the run...but I think it is about much more than that.
Midday
I kind of figured you'd think I was proving your point on the numbers. :)
I guess what I'm trying to say is just because the numbers permeate the show doesn't mean they are an influence. jmo I could be wrong.
Yes the first arg The Lost Experience stated that the numbers were The Valenzetti Equation which determined the end of man kind. To save man kind one or more of the numbers needed to be changed. I think it was e eventually considered canon.
Amy Lynn
That's how Iook at the title too. But agree it can be seen both ways.
futureself
I can see your view point on the time line bleeding over into the reset time line. That maybe she helped Claire because of motherly instinct. But as you said she's always had bouts of being altruisic.
She did look over her shoulder and see the police car, and when the nurse asked her if she was with Claire she said yes. I think she was afraid if she left in the stolen taxi she could be caught. She could deal with getting out of the hospital later.
BTW I'm not a Kate hater. Just so you know. :)
Sorry - the rug translations are from the Illiad, not the Odyssey, as I said. That makes sense as the Illiad is a story of war and the Odyssey of a journey- to home as it turns out.They match the tapestries.
About the numbers- there is an interesting bit in the Jeremy Davies LU course reading list book- it is "The Field" by Lynne McTaggart. This part describes how one woman's photon emissions over the course of a year had cycles of 7,14,32,80 and 270 days.
I think the numbers may prove to be some kind of natural rhythm that doesn't really have an "explanation" any more than, say, the speed of light does.
Not at all sayid'girl...I don't think your a Kate hater for commenting....
Absolutely agree that Kate went into the hospital because the cops were about. However, again, it's about the perspective of the situation....
Yes the first arg The Lost Experience stated that the numbers were The Valenzetti Equation which determined the end of man kind. To save man kind one or more of the numbers needed to be changed. I think it was e eventually considered canon.
I had a weird idea, and didn't post earlier b/c there is probably no merit to it due to all the posts from the ARG and evidence that it is what it is...but....why not, since the convo has turned towards the #s... What if that smeared # was not a 42? What if one "variable" in that equation was wrong? ex. Was it a 47 not a 42??
Just a thought. Again, I know how much is out there re: the #s... so this one probably doesn't have much merit...
And, while we might postulate that one of the DIs created the equation, or someone related to Hanso...etc.. where did Danielle get them? From the blast door?
Danielle heard them and went to investigate and crashed on the reef.
Ahhh. that's right, they were on the broadcast tower before she put her message there... how I forgot that is beyond me... but thanks for the reminder... so we still don't know who was broadcasting them originally? or in my infinite forgetfulness, do we know that too?
If you can, I would recommend watching BBC Horizons 'To Infinity and Beyond'. It's available on iplayer for the Ukers and by other methods for those outside ;)
Ded- did you say: this is why it's 2007 and not 2004. ?
Did I get it wrong about the date on the sonogram- thought it was Oct 2004?
What I meant to say was , this is why it is 2007 on the island in present time and not 2004, which is when they started flashing from.
whew! I finally made it back online...first, I had no internet, then, my computer decided to crash but good...I lost all my stuff.
Now, we were finally able to buy a new system and I have the internet and I'm back for good. (Just in case anyone missed me! :D)
xxoo
I really agree with futureself about Kate. I think her character got sort of under-valued because of all the Jack-Sawyer-whatever stuff. I am a Kate fan, and I still think she can redeem herself.
Hi Ellen
I missed you. :)
I'm in the same boat as you, crashed computer. I haven't heard back from my friend who's working on It yet. I've been using my phone to post. It's making me crazy.
And glad you're here, Ellen!
@Ellen:Glad you got everything fixed and you're back!
Watching the Olympic's Opening Ceremony now....Vancouver is gorgeous!
I was thinking about it and I think the island being underwater may be why the black rock is in the middle of the island. I think that before dharma built the orchid and swan the island could still be moved by the FDW, which was obviously built by some ancient types. If you will recall when ben moved the island the first time. The people were looking from the chopper saw the island literally disappear. The strange thing is you would think that the island moving through time or space would leave a gaping hole in the waterand surrounding ocean water would fill it in, but the island was replaced with an equal amount of water form some place else or some other time. I think that the water had to come from wherever the island went. This may seem like a small detail, but it huge. It means that when the island moves an equal inverse affect happens to the other place. so the water is actually traveling where the island was as well. What if the time jumps or the sideways reality have the same equilibrium working. I bet the island has been under water before. What if the island is just underwater to hide it in 2004.
Second this season isn't the first time we have seen sideways realitys, every time desmond saw charlie die a different way was a sideways reality. Each time a course correction was trying to happen. Well dan said the swan thing was a boulder in the pond, but i think the sideways reality is so close to the old one because it is a great big batch of course corrections to deal with the boulder in the pond.
one difference that's huge is that fact that hugo is now lucky or the numbers are, but everything else is the same. that will mean something
Well, after reading three days of thoughts, my only conclusions are:
1. This wasn't a filler episode, we learned some stuff.
2. It's way too early to use what little we learned to try and make sense of the series.
--
I took from the "testing" that it was using electrical frequencies - like the sonar fence. Maybe Sayid's reactions showed he was affected by a current that wouldn't affect the unclaimed?
maven
I watched the opening ceremonies last night too. They put on an amazingly beautiful show.
Very sad and tragic about the young Georgian luger.
I like linking the sonar fence to the testing.
Hey maybe MIB is a young Alvar Hanso. j/k kind of. That thought came from all the numbers talk last night and thinking about the Valenzetti Equation. Mittlewerk wanted to kill 1/3 of the population or was it 2/3 and save 1/3? It's early I can't remember. Anyway maybe that's what MIB is doing. Killing off a certain percentage.
Wow that sounds really bad after reading it. lol
Time for caffine. :)
hawkings told jack and company that the island was always moving. So unless jughead affected the frozen donkey wheel. I don't think that the island will just stay underwater forever. The way the sideways reality 815 experienced serious turbulence seems to show the island still has some electromagnetic mojo, and if so it will probably move on it's own. If the island lost its electromagnetic field then why would the dharma shark still be hanging out there 30 years later. I think the island hasn't been underwater for 30 years. The foot and barracks would be covered in algae and seaweed, 30 years worth.
If there isn't more then one smoke monster then i think smokey might be like a community lawnmower. I bet mib doesn't have exclusive use of smokey or else richard would have known who flocke was right away. It might explain why we have never seen mib turn into smokey directly.
To further my thought that ghosts cant touch anything. I think that dave was mib or smokey, how else would he slap hugo with his slipper. If you'll recall dave tried to have hugo kill himself. I'm sure mib would love if jacob did not have use of hurley in the future, for instance the temple wouldn't have been prepared for mib if ghost jacob didn't use hurley. I think that just like "something/one" was trying to kill charlie to hurt mib's plan. No looking glass, no frieghter ect. I think the same force was trying to kill locke periodically, to foil mib. The most obvious case of that was Ethan being right there during a time flash shooting locke. Mib righted his plan by having richard stitch locke up.
I think Dogen was telling the truth about why he spoke japanese. It was to keep the redshirt others out of the loop. I think only he and lennon are privy to much of the island mysticism. Thats why the dude from room 23 is such a dolt. He is just a pwan or footsoldier. Lennon and Dogen wanted to know when jacob was coming to the temple. Hurley told them he was dead. How is it that jacob was known to come to the temple, yet Ben had never met him. Ben was or is the leader of all the others including the temple others. He sent cindy there in the first place. I think that's why flocke was grilling ben about the cabin incident. Ben said it was a trick, but talking to an empty rocking chair is pretty lame trick/plan. How did ben know the rocking chair dude would freak out. Ben didn't miss a beat when he acted like jacob was throwing him against the wall. There is something more there. Ben knew something was going to happen in there. makes me think Ben has been working with christain for quite some time. I also think that richard , Ben, or both are pretending to be so surprised at what mib has done. Why would widmore know of the war that was coming , but not richard or ben?
I hope you don't mind a repeat of a view of mine on The Numbers, I'll add something new,,so hang with me, okay.
Any Number by itself means nothing,,is Pure, neither Good or Bad until a Human assigns the " What" to the quantitative value..4 by itself is an abstract,,pure,,until we say..4 apples,,4 cars,, 4 cups of coffee..etc etc. So..Hurley as Irony,,Comedy,,Humor,,assigning Superstition to a set of numbers,,is Irony. It says more about Hurley..than the numbers. Just as the fictional Valezetti assigning the " end of the world" to the set of numbers,,says more about Valenzetti..than the numbers.
So..presenting the Surreal perspective on things LOST,,as I do,,and mentioning Andre Breton at just about every opportunity as I am prone to do,,the Numbers do not escape into the mundane. Andre Breton wrote the classic surreal novel, " Nadja". Included in the novel are 44 photographs of people, places and things that the author and " Nadja" explore the Surreality of. The photos are like picture postcards from a mental trip or exploration. The intersection of Hurleys Numbers and Nadja's Numbered Photographs is a very busy " intersection" indeed, with no red lites nor pedestrian cross walks with signs telling you when its safe to walk. But what you find on the otherside,,across the street,,is fascinating in its Linkage to things LOST. The first and easier Link is the number 4,,The 4th photo is of Paul Eulard. Paul was a fellow orginal Surrealist and Friend of Andre Breton. The story thatgoes along with the photo..is of a " chance meeting" with Paul ,,a few days before the appointed official introduction of the two strangers.Connected personalities seemed the point. Kinda like our Losties,,and reminiscent of Carlton's podcast tale of him and Damon bumping into George Lucas at Disney Land, was it, at nearly the same time,,years before they were introduced to each other to do lOST..Connectivity.. The #42 photo,,the last of Hurley's numbers..is interestingly a photo of a " billboard" advertisement of a Light Bulb..Illumination,, Enlightenment being the message. The Numbers between 4 and 42 as applied to the photos , have fascinating linkage to LOST,,but,,as said,,you have to have the perception, the state of mind , to see it. I aim only to add dimension to the understanding of Hurley's Numbers.Maybe like Des keeps saying..see ya in another life.
MEL
I also think we need to find out more about dharma. Why would jacob have a truce with dharma. Why does dharma use the numbers on stuff? Why does dharma use the same egyptian stuff as the others,i.e. swan clock glyphs,anks,ect. The greenhouse seems like it's the other's. Why would they let dharma build the orchid there? What do the leaders in Ann Arbor mean to the sideways reality?
You know I've never thought Des' see ya in another life line was a throwaway line. I always felt he'd actually see you in another life or reality. But I could be wrong.
SG,,I'm with ya on that throw away line..matter of fact I go even further..the more a line in LOST is a trow away line..the more Important it is to seeing this show for what it is...That very Ironic or inside out perception is the key to understanding LOST..imho....Seeing Lost in its " opposite" brings understanding and fulfillment best. It works soooo well,,Another favorite throw away line of mine is Lockes.." we are all Others"..exactamondo ole bic head!!
Again..what is Illusion and what is Real has been at the foundation of this show all along.
MEL
I wish people would accept that smokey IS MIB. Jacob might also be able to smoke himself, but certainly, the two are one.
Dave, Christian and Locke have all been manifestations of MIB. Anyone who dies on the island is potential for MIB to steal the "essence" of.
I like Dogen, but I don't trust Lennon.
At this point in the story, I'm not 100% (or even 1%) sure who is manifested by whom! I'm beginning to think that Jacob and MIB can both take other form and "claim" bodies. The main question I have is: Whose bodies are they in when they have that conversation about progress on the beach in S5? I always thought that MIB bore a resemblance to Alvar Hanso...thinking he was Magnus...but if Magnus, as Capt. of the Black Rock, was just being lured to the island, that wouldn't work!
Happy Valentine's Day tomorrow to all my TLC family! :)
Ben..try..death on the Island is nothing more than the " end" of that way of being. Shannon was very vain..She died..Vanity has been excused from the repertoire of..Who Am I?..or ..what it is to be a " Human Being". I mean,,redemption isn't painless. Bad habits have to go or be dealt with.
Follow this line of thinking,,and maybe you can see that Smokie,,wasn't controlled by anything overtly,,until MIB was liberated. Yes,, MIB took control of Smokie. the Conscience. Jacob was too laid back about everything to even have concern about Smokie.
I have " sympathy" for Dogen. A possible Tragedy in the making there..A man and his Dogma..facing inevitable Change..will he survive or prefer to die, commit hari-kari instead..? I prefer not to see his guts all over the floor of the temple. Lennon..because he does not question anything..and just repeats what ever the Dogen says...either starts questioning or..dies. I have little sympathy for that unfortunate character. How ironic that he is named Lennon.
imho..
MEL
only Darlton have confirmed that Locke was smokey. Locke "found his loophole", ergo, the same guy.
MEL- It seemed to me that Lennon was questioning some- translating the order to shoot the Losties by Dogen he asks-are you sure? And it seems he was directed to tell Sayid he passed the test- but then is concerned enough about it to say -I just lied to him didn't I? When Jack asks if something is funny he seems to say the Dogen- "doesn't really have a sense of humor." Is that a criticism?
Lennon doesn't seem angry or rebellious- but he does seem a bit worried to me.
JT..Lennon did slough off the order to shoot them,,as in.." oh well"..or 'mox nix.."..it didn't matter to him. It should have mattered ..imho. That he asked if he just told a lie..is only a reflection of Sayids new ability to make every one around him to tell the truth...imho. Interestingly..that Lennon told a lie..seemed to matter not..okay I told a lie..carry on..so what. The same " oh well" as displayed in the shoot them scene,,seemed a characteristic of this Lennon.
I guess what I'msaying JT..is that I can have only the Hope that these characters have for them selves..or as much Hope as the writers bestow them with..So..that these characters appear only to have Hope in the Status Quo and Change is knocking at the door..oh my.
.Yes,, it would be fascinating for the Temple-iestas to actually go thru a ARC of change..but that would mean Dogen too,,has to change. The slitest hints are there,,but time is running out. Cindy Still Gave Jack That Extra Bottle of Vodka..no change in the story there..so...change doesn't seem possible for these Temple-iestas.
MEL
Well, she only gave him one at least.
Mile High JT? Oh...right, vodka ;)
2 costa said I was thinking about it and I think the island being underwater may be why the black rock is in the middle of the island.
All my little light bulbs lit at this reason! ;-) Makes sense! So, if we postulate this- we have to postulate that it's moved before "as a measure of last resort".... what was the threat that time? how many times...and is what ben and lock did as far as moving the island with the wheel, the same as "always moving'?
I agree that we'll see more to the numbers than just the Valenzetti equation one way or another. Looking forward to it!
Amy Lynn posted this at Lost ARGs.
Thanks Amy love it.
Snow Sculpture
To go with the notion that sayid makes people tell the truth now. When oldham gave him some hallucinogens, he said it was a truth serum. Sayid did in fact tell the absolute truth to the dharma guys, which led him to where he is now.
I was thinking that maybe dogen was asking how sayid got shot for more literal reasons. Perhaps the bullet being a 1977 bullet from a 1977 gun of Roger linus makes some kind of difference. Perhaps it is more of a time paradox than the island likes and is causing the reaction.
Future- I thought about being more careful with that- but Naah-:)
2Costa- it is true that Jack never really answered the question. We just see him take the responsiblity for Sayid being there/helping (as we do then with the shared responsibility being taken for Juliette). Maybe the answer makes a difference...???
I was watching the Jimmy Fallon "Late" parody just now and noticed that he meets Jane ("Kate") right away. So that made me think- Kate wasn't on the first beach scene in the pilot? Did we first see her in the jungle when she sews up Jack?
I'm sure it's been discussed -probably a long time ago here - but is this more proof of a flash in by Kate and Jack from the previous go round?
Happy Valentines Day everyone.
Don't get shot with one of those flaming arrows though.
Happy Valentines Day LoCos.
Happy Valentine's Day LoCos!
Has everyone seen the new Dharma station print glasses available at ABC.com? only $29.95...I want a set! (should I wait a few years until I can find them on eBay for cheap?) And the Bobblehead Dolls on the same page...Richard Alpert? Faraday? Dr Chang? LOL hysterical!
Amused
I seen those. I'd like to at least get a Sayid bobblehead since they cancel the McFarlane series right before his figure came out. I'll probably have the same luck though. :)
Good Morning All, May all your days be Valentine.
Seems a loose knit theory of Mirrors is catching on in some Lost sites. Which is good. The idea of two realities at the same time ..even one in opposite orientation to the other,plays right into the Surreal view of Man living in two realities simultaneously and is conflicted by the constant struggle between the two for supremacy over Self. Seems to me,,a Hall of Mirrors perspective has been brought up here already. The repeat of mirrors in the first 3 episodes of season 6 suggests a reflection on the idea is warranted if not already thought about. Apparently, a new promo release has many abuzz over the Mirror concept. Its really a good visual metaphor for the dual existence of mankind. Eliminating the Mirror..forces a one existence..a unification,,a wholeness. Not so fast there, your hair must be perfect for Valentines Day...but thats okay..I still Love you.
MEL
happy valentines day
loved the four snowed statue
Happy Valentine's Day to all you Desmonds and Pennys out there!
I ordered those Dharma glasses! Thanks, Amused, for the link!
Happy Valentine's Day, y'all. I'm taking the SO to brunch, and bought him flowers, and a card... because a) I love him and b) our 2 year anniversary falls on May 23rd, and I feel REALLY badly about that, in advance.
Speakin of Mirrored Reality...a post of it here for any who didn't catch it originally..Emerson on Soup
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eRJvaQuCh5c
what a hoot!!..Makes the LOST SUPPER poster, the one where all the characters are looking at Us..seem quite appropo.
Emerson on Soup,,D&C on The Onion webcast..hhhmm...if ya can't laff at yourself,,who can you laff at?
Heehee Mel...great clip! Define reality :D
Also, I have been looking into Breton (well peeking really) and the Surrealist manifesto, in which Breton mentions his dream of seeing a man half in and half out of a window and the glass slicing him in two. I'm sure I've probably missed the point of his story but the imagery seems to lend itself to the mirror worlds, perhaps more fittingly? As you mention, the mirror concept discussed explores the duality of man and by eliminating the mirror you force the wholeness. Perhaps I prefer the imagery of the severed man for both it's humour and macabre but the urgency and the need to remove the glass and rejoin the man is far more poignant than the mirror. The difficulty and somewhat impossibility of this too is apparent, as is the different functions of the split. They MUST rejoin, and MUST become whole.
i think i said this before but I think richard was a lot more slick in the original reality then we have been shown yet. I think when he knocked out eloise right before they took jughead through the barracks, . He was saving her in the sideways reality as well. He knew they were going to detonate a nuke on the island. He said it was his job to protect her. He either took her somewhere on the island where she would survive the whole jughead thing or he took her off the island, and if he knew island might not survive then taking her off island was his only option, he probably used the same method to get off the island that he used in 1955 before he had a sub. I think we will see a living dan faraday in the sideways reality as well as hawkings. One thing is he is featured on the lost season six poster. I also think that if the major brush strokes are the same in both timelines hawkings and faraday are to important to not be there. The universe course corrects, penny was there to save the oceanic six because they HAD TO SURVIVE. I think for the same reason dan and his mom will have survived the sinking of the island. This may also tie into the island not sinking in 1977 or at least not sinking very fast. We already know jacob somehow survived into the sideways reality, otherwise locke would be dead and not handicapped.
Another thing i was thinking is maybe you can only be claimed when you have died or near died. We see this with claire and sayid this week. Also maybe jacob claimed locke after he fell from the window, so locke needed to die again in order for mib to claim him, or mib has never claimed locke rather just can impersonate him..
Future...How freekin Ironic and Surreal,,to put the essence of LOST..in the SOUP..Define Reality...what a freekin hoot!!
The cut in half man..The challenge for me in watching LOST..ever since the Jack's Opening Eye..has been finding Breton and his fellow Surrealists in LOST..The Opening EYE..is the Surreal symbol for the Dual existence of Man.. The EYE..is the Gateway between the Two Realities...external and internal..
Now..TPTB don't want to be called plagiarists and I am certainly not doing so. The Mirror metaphor works well for me and kudos to TPTB.The Fun of LOST, for me..is how TPTB..have updated , revitalized, modernized the ideas of the original Surrealists..Finding Breton in the dialogue,,music,,editing, directing, acting,,and in the combinations of them..has been a real " fun" trip..If You Find Breton,,then You Find Yourself,,which completes the loop to what Damon or JJ said on season 1 DVD..Lost was originally conceived to be the Ultimately Reality show. It was said that Damon and JJ spent days together conceiving and formulating this thing called LOST..I believe it..
Ladles and jellyspoons, hoboes and tramps,
Cross-eyed mosquitoes and bow-legged ants.
On this braw dark moonlicht nicht I see,
Perhaps what Jack's cut-throat could be ...
...innkeeping with the surreal serving pints of idiocromatic transparancy my mind wandered to 1989 and Richard (of the E.Grant variety) and How to Get a Head in Advertising. But it's only a scratch, not a pimple...still, two heads are better than one...no?
I'm not sure we should assume that being means being claimed by MIB or Jacob. What if it means something completely different?
Oh Geez!!!
assume that being claimed
mungonna, that painting in jacob's cabin was sort or surealist right?
2costa, I wouldn't say the painting of Jacob's Dog was surrealist at all. In fact it can be seen as a parody of the Mona Lisa by Da Vinci (Italian Renaissance). Just because is it a parody doesn't make it surreal.
2c..the dog ,,looking very humanly comfortable..but not comfortable for a dog..? I remember it being a painting of a dog,,but which painting.? If you are looking for something Surreal in Lost..the whole darn show,,top to bottom, is a surreal presentation...is a Surreal Painting...The opening Eye tells you that.
Another note on " finding Breton"...It was his or one of his co-surrealists that said...Man Is Soluble...dissolves in the water that he finds himself in..hence all the jokes about " fish" with Surrealism..but wait,,look at all the tributes to " fish" in LOST...and..lo and behold..what method is Sayid transformed by..how is Sayid reborn?..and that it was Not the same as the Temple-iestas were use to..HA!..Surrealism is the Infection that is Health and is the darkness that is enlightenment..
Geesh..I'm startin to dislike the Dogen. No more sympathy for that butt wipe. He is Illusion. He admits to it when he says he uses Japanese to get people to do what they may not want to..That is the whole purpose of Illusion.
MEL
..Wait a minute Furure..a parody of Mona Lisa...uhhmmm... it was Marcel Duchamp who did the moustache on Mona Lisa..a great hit at the time..and of course..he was a friend of...well you know...So ..yea..if its the painting I'm thinking of now..in its parody..it is surreal.
MEL
Well Dali did a self portrait as the Mona Lisa which was most certainly surreal (to the point you don't know whether to laugh, scream or throw up:
Dali Lisa
And Duchamp's mustached Mona was surreal for the time (Mona Lisa is depicted with no facial hair, not even eyebrows - so I guess a hairy dog replacement is kind of funny)...but of course we tend not to class Banksy as a surrealist for doing far cleverer things. He is a a graffiti artist, anti- capitalist and anarchistic. But then, yes, I suppose ultimately he is surreal- funny that the labels are the very thing he rally against...
So the Jacob's dog can be seen as a mirror image of the Mona Lisa (in terms of positioning). She has been described as a "kind of mythic embodiment of eternal femininity", who is "older than the rocks among which she sits" and who "has been dead many times and learned the secrets of the grave."
So Mel, despite my rationalising, I still see it as a parody though. What's the difference? Parodying the surreal...
Okay...so I've had a fish biscuit and pondered a bit more on this...I guess it is surreal. The mirroring of the eyebrowless Mona Lisa to the very facially hairy dog...the implications for the embodiment of 'eternal femininity' and the well, core of cainininity is pretty damn surreal. Perhaps that crazy theory I read about them all being rabbits in some experiment ain't that crazy ;)
2Costa- 6 numbers in the numbers.... Oceanic 6. Perhaps the numbers in addition to the Valenzetti equation, symbolize the 6 characters who left? those who "had" to survive? could each number represent one of the Oceanic 6? Each a variable in that equation?
O/T, apparently Kevin Smith got booted off a Southwest flight for being "too fat"... he posted this on Twitter:
ThatKevinSmith
Dear Other Airlines (including Oceanic, sans Flight 815): I'm in the market for a flight east this Thurs. Which one of you likes fat people?
AL- that just came on the news... just after i refereshed these posts... surrreal.... ;-) Kidding.
But speaking of... I don't know much Breton, so I've been looking online (so as not to be totally ignorant). If anyone out there is in the boat with me...there's a number of links to his manifesto online... I do see lot's of LOST (Locke) in it! Thanks for broadening my horizons!
here is a link to a Andre Breton page..cliick on the upper left biography,,and read Caws and Rosemonts introductions first..then Bretons Manifestos then perhaps Nadja ,,Humor Noir..Magnetic Field Lines..etc,,Its not a bad idea to readup on Rene Magritte either. How he deals with and perceives Mystery...is LOST...imho.
http://www.studiocleo.com/librarie/breton/bretonpage.html
I sincerely hope that the book Nadja,,will be displayed in LOST before its over.
MEL
NEW POST
i have a b.a in art, so i know enough to know that you are all right about the painting. I was posing the question, i think it was loosely surrealist. I can see dali doing something like that. Ultimately i think all perspectives are correct.
2costa said...
one difference that's huge is that fact that hugo is now lucky or the numbers are, but everything else is the same. that will mean something.
Of course, it should be pointed out, Hurley most likely did not use The Numbers to win in the sideways reality. If the island is underwater, Lenny never intercepted them in the pacific, and thus was not mumbling them in the hospital... in fact, he was not even in the hospital, since the numbers driving him mad are what put him there. If Lenny doesn't tell the numbers to Hurley, Hurley doesn't know them and likely didn't use them.
We haven't been told what numbers he used...
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