Sunday, February 14, 2010

The Lost Community Podcast - Episode 69

Join Host's David A Dein and Steve "The Goog" Guglich on an exciting adventure full of flashortunities. Don't know what that is, listen as they unlock the mystery's and even come up with something that Kate MUST DO.

If you'd like to be a guest on the podcast, have any theories, discover any clues, or just want to say "Hi!", contact TLCpodcast@gmail.com (mp3 comments are accepted as well), or leave a voice mail or fax at (206) 202-3512.

Episode 69 - What Kate Does

115 comments:

Amy Lynn said...

I'm still unable to download last week's podcast, and don't see this one, either. The only one iTunes has is 12/31 :(

Sayid'sgirl said...

Thanks David. I've been waitng for your podcast.

maven said...

Will listen shortly!

mungonna said...

I'm sorry to report that after listening to the first few minutes of kavetching about this episode and Kate character..I turned the podcast off...

Its like this..if an episode,, or a character brings you frustration, disappointment,,etc..the first to consider should be..is perhaps how it is being perceived is what is bringing the frustration and disappointment. In other words..the wrongness of how you see the episode brings you more wrongness.

There is a way to see this episode,,and Kate,,and Kate over the seasons that brings much more gladness, appreciation and actually helps in understanding LOST rather than the kavetching I heard in the first few minutes....Kate as Free Will.. will help see her role in this menagerie of card board thin characters. Over the seasons..its important to see the theme of a character expand out,,same theme but taken further out in effect and consequence. So..the basic change from Kavetch to appreciation is from logical linear thought to spherical , parable thinking and seeing. Much more happyness is there.

What Kate DID.. is simply realized ..Free Will exercised means little,,if not extended to another Human Being.. this is a statement on What it is to be a Human Being..A Truth,,and a part to the answer of the reoccurring question of LOST..Who Am I?... So,, questions are being answered,,and they do pertain to the Big Picture. Rather than just a " filler" this episode was a Major piece of the pie..But a pie is round , circular, spherical..so I understand how it isn't being seen. Seems to me by end of show.. many will change their minds about this episode.

as MIB Locke put it..I'm disappointed in you all.
MEL

Capcom said...

I still haven't changed how I feel about Kate-centric episodes, especially Eggtown. :o)

mungonna said...

Seems to me ..that the presented character of Kate..is as Free Will.. There is a frustration built in automatically with Kate..We.. the audience,, can't be Free and Unencumbered as Kate is presented. We would like to be.. but can't be..so frustration is subtle but its there. Kate, as with all the characters,,remains basically true to her theme,but its the consequences and effects that expand out from season to season to be mindful of. I don't understand how it is that the same kavetching about Kate from season 1-2 to season 5-6..doesn't apply to the other characters... Sawyer hasn't changed that much.. Jack hasn't,, matter of fact the central Losties keep failing to change and thats their problem..Yet Kate gets all the grief for being a tired character.Double standards being applied seems to me..I mean.. if you have a problem with Kate character.. then you have a problem with the whole show..because WHOLENESS is where this show is going. All these characters have been true to their Theme...so its the theme that is bothersome in particular. Which again.. to me.. says more about the viewer than the character.

Sorry.. like Damon and Carlton,,its season 6,, the last season.. so all the stops are being pulled,,what have They.. or I.. or You.. got to lose? This is It..

MEL

Sayid'sgirl said...

You have to everything that David and Steve say with a grain of salt. They like to have fun in their podcast. If had continued to listen you would have heard David say he liked the episode.
Also just because there are people who don't see things in the surreal doesn't make them wrong or more wrong. But I respect your point of view. :)

Sayid'sgirl said...

Please forgive my typos. I'm stll using this stupid phone to make post. Not that I don't make th anyway,just not many. lol

Ellen said...

Hi ya'll!
I've had about 2000 emails to catch up on, still working on it...hope all of you had a wonderful Valentine's Day! I'll be back a little later after I listen to the podcast...:D
xx00

David A Dein said...

Mungonna,

So wait... If I percieve something differently then you I'm wrong??

Kate's Character can be rather silly at times, and I am still really tired of the love triangle stuff which has added nothing to the show ever. But if you listened a little further I clearly stated that Kate's Goal is to be Aaron's Guardian. It's that realtionship that the writers should have exploited.

Grrr... but let's let bygones be bygones, and why don't you come on the show next week and tell us your feelings on Kate. Our podcast doesn't exist in a bubble and I've offered a shoit for anyone on TLC to come join us. What do you think?

Sayid'sgirl said...

Good morning Ellen.
Well since I'm OCD I had made a post fixing last nights mistakes. Decided to copy it so I in case I lost it when I posted like last night I wouldn't have to retype it. Needless to say that didn't work. I hit paste by mistake and lost it anyway. I see a mistake in this post but it's to hard to go back and fix. I'm tired of retyping everything. I'm pretty sure you cam understand what I was trying to say even with the omited words and typos. So I just going to Leave them the way they are.
Well that only took 20 minutes, can't wait til Tuesday.

mungonna said...

Dave..What is "wrong" is your disappointment. Do you like being disppointed? Do you like being frustrated with the Love Triangle and its so called going nowhwere,,tiredness?

My point is..Points of view are indeed varied..expected. Yet, consider where they bring you to.If its continued frustration and disappointment, at some point one might want to reconsider their pov. One can decide. Abandon whats make one frustrated or try a different pov.

Its a very interesting phenomina that Kate centric epoisodes are usually the low scoring episodes by the popular. The Kate character also has a large quanity of Kate haters . This observation is based on a few boards quick observations. " Filler" episode seems assigned to Kate Centric episodes. When I see or hear, " Filler" I hear " I didn't Get It".

There is no "Filler" episode from the writers and TPTB perspective. These guys are professionals and I think the term " Filler" is an insult to them. I think a more honest term like.." I Didn't Get It" seems a lot more reasonable.
Rather than blame the show or episode or a character for disappointment,,I think the blame should start with being honest enough with ones self. " I didn't get It,,seems a good first step. It leads to attempting to " get it"

There is a problem with the Kate character. As Free Will,, she does stuff that we can't..We would like to,,but we can't. There is an envy in that and envy leads to Hate. IMHO,,Kate Haters ( and I'm not saying anybody here is a Kate Hater) are self loathing. Her freedom upsets to the point of hating the freedom any of us can have , if we choose.

So..agreeing with you or not isn't the point. Its agreeing with your results. If watching the show brings you frustration..disappointment..why do you settle for that..why do you agree with that. I'm absolutely positive that TPTB,,don't set out to bring you disappointment..They certainly set out to Challenge You though. I am suggesting to redirect the disappointment into meeting the Challenge. The results can be a lot more satisfying.

have a good day
MEL

2costa said...

i think that perception being different from different POV's is a big part of the series. We are all others to someone. I think last season they did a slick thing making us think jacob and the others are the good guys. Especially in" the incident", but sun and frank aren't convinced and apparently neither is claire. Saying the others are for sure the good guys is like saying, you are good if you are white in chess or evil if you are black. It just doesn't apply

2costa said...

I was thinking about ben being told by alex to listen to john locke. Mib seems to be subject to the same rules of "free will" that the others seem to follow. I bet if mib would have strong armed ben into killing jacob directly it would have broken the rules, but there in lies mib's genius. If Falex, would have told ben to do whatever smokey/mib wanted or she would kill him herself that would have broken the rules of free will. Here wording and trickery are the loophole or boulder knocked from the ceiling. Falex said " do whatever JOHN LOCKE says or i will kill u myself". Ben perceived Flocke as the real john locke and thought he was following her orders. If ben knew the whole truth about flocke at the time, he wouldn't have had to follow those directions since he wasn't the real thing. I'm still trying to figure out why illana and bram let ben and flocke leave hydra island if they already had dead locke in the crate or didn't follow them, unless that was their instructions from jacob. This may also tie to the free will rules and an intervention by illana may have been against the rules.

2costa said...

it's a lot like how ben used to make people do stuff by indirect persuasion. Julliette stay here by your own free will and ill cure your sisters cancer. Jack do my surgery and i'll let u leave the island.

I wonder if the temple spring just didn't cure ben's cancer or if he wasn't given the opportunity to try to heal it there. The enhanced 6x1 said julliette knew about the healing properties of the spring, so if she knew ben knew. i wonder if her Scientology tattoo revoked her temple pool privileges?

2costa said...

i mean enhanced 6x2

2costa said...

i wonder if the island would have sunk if desmond didn't turn the failsafe key way back when. So maybe no kelvin or desmond and island sinks

2costa said...

Dogen's baseball probably isn't as meaningless as it might seem. I think it's been pounted out that a baseball has 108 stiches and a very yin/yang appearance. I think it may be pointing to how jacob and mib seem to know about the future. In the first episode of deep space nine Cisco uses the baseball on his desk as a metaphor about how aliens in the wormhole experience time all at once instead of seeing it linearly. Which was a nod to the tralmaphrodrians from slaughterhouse five and the way that they also see all of time at once and admire the peaks and valleys as a whole...

2costa said...

being "unstuck" in time, which is a slaughterhouse five term, just means you are slipping out of being a fool who is trapped by time and space and gaining a more tralmaphradorian perspective.

MadAriad said...

Hey! Checking in for email! I haven't been able to listen yet but hopefully soon. We're signing papers on a house tomorrow and probably moving on Friday, so I'll have very little free time the next week or two (or three or four)!!

One little thought I had about What Kate Does: Dogen mentions that lots of people have been hurt because of helping Jack, and the pill is a way to redeem himself. So I was thinking that in the SF's maybe Jack is doing that already: offering to help John with his back, saving Charlie's life (rather than Charlie dying because of helping Jack contact the freighter). I think I already mentioned that I think Kate is somehow redeeming herself in the FS.

That's my thought for the day.

Have a nice Monday off!

lost2010 said...

I don't see how it's wrong to be disappointed with the show. And not every episode is a good episode.

Eggtown is terrible. Stranger in a Strange Land is terrible. Fire and Water is terrible. Expose still seems pretty pointless.

That doesn't take away from the overall excellence of the series as a whole. In fact, it shows how excellent the series is that the bad episodes can be named on one hand.

I don't think 'What Kate Does' was terrible, incidentally, but it wasn't as good as LA X.

Amy Lynn said...

I actually thought What Kate Does was a big improvement over the snoozefest that was LA X. :)

lost2010 said...

But Boone and Charlie were in LA X. lol Characters I care about (Boone/Charlie) vs. characters I don't care nearly as much about (Claire/Aaron). lol

I've been backing the wrong horses in this show for so long it isn't funny. ;)

maven said...

Morning all (yes, it's still morning here)!

I thought the episode had a lot of subtleties, and we did get some "whoa" moments (Clousseau). This was really the first sideways flash look at one of our characters (I'm sure we're in for everyone's eventually). Sure, it wasn't as exciting and action driven as other ones (like a premiere usually is). But I have every faith in Darlton, and every episode is there for a reason in the overall story. Patience is a virtue.

Hey, congrats to MadAriad on becoming a new homeowner!

We get your meaning, Sayidsgirl...Don't stress out on the typos...I'll never be a good iPhone typist!

Capcom said...

LOL Lost2010, me too.

It's fine and normal for audiences to comment on what they might not like artistically, especially when it comes to TV. You can totally enjoy a body of work like a series, and not be completely happy or entertained by one aspect of it, such as an episode or character. It's the same as liking a piece of art enough to own it, and also thinking wow, why did they put that color in that corner there. We spent a lot of time hashing over that concept during the hiatus! X-D

I agree that the podcasts are for fun and don't need to be taken ultra-seriously, SG. It's too bad that this is the final season and that the new friends to the LoCo blog won't have much time to get used to our crazy style of loose critique and discussion that has evolved over the past couple/few years. I think then it would be understood better if there was more time. It's all for friendly fun and opinions, that's all. :o)

Sayid'sgirl said...

Congrats MadAriad on getting a new house.
maven thanks I'll try not to stress over the typos.
lost2010 You think you back the wrong characters? My favorite character is a torturer. But I believe he wants to be a good person. He just hasn't figured out how to accomplish that yet. Or doesn't believe he deserves it.
Capcom I agree it takes a little time to see where we come from. We love wacky theories and having fun.

2costa said...

I think the first three have been ok, but more of a setup for 6x4 and 6x5, im hoping those are gonna be the "lockdown" or "the long con" in quality so far this season. We needed all the setup of sawyer, flocke, jack, and sayid's storys to give the next few their gravitas. Even in the stinker episodes like most kate episodes, I still enjoy the few morsels they throw us in all those episodes. I'd say kate's first centric was the best, with the whole bank heist. It showed us how badass kate could be. Eggtown was the worst. this newest one was somewhere in the middle. I still enjoyed the dogen parts. I curious to see what happens next with ben and flocke. As much as expose was pretty lame, i liked that they showed ben and julliette at the swan. Julliette died before revealing most of what she knew of the others. That scene in the pearl reinforces that.

TheOtherLisa said...

Random thought first about claiming:
Sawyer, "What Kate Did" --- asks Kate, "Why did you kill me?" We assumed that meant Wayne.... is there any chance Sawyer might have really been dead? Even for a brief time, and "claimed"?

Anyway... Kate is one of my faves, sorry all. What does Kate do? She rescues, or at least she means to: her mom, the farmer, those at the bank...etc.... The triangle is not useless--it is also rescue, trying to rescue the good parts of each man. I can't quote surrealism (though "get" it a little better now), I can't keep up with the sci-fi math (no chance of me getting that!), but that's my take and I'm sticking to it. ;-) Until someone legitimately changes my mind!

I can see the Aaron's guardian angel possibility.... re: how many of us have made bad decisions out of protection, love, trying to help? and just don't seem to "get it"? That's why lessons are learned the hard way. Part of free will Kate is the choice to love and be bound to those she loves rather than to be free of them- she just loves so much she doesn't allow others free will. In my uneducated opinion, just based on "life"- is one of the most "bound" and "chained" ways to be for the good bad and ugly.

In some respects, I see her as more altruistic than many of the other characters. She sees responsibility where the problem is not hers to "right". Admirable, human, loving... sometimes, maybe a skewed version of honorable. We also see that in Sawyer- who in so many scenes is off to do his own thing and turns around to "do the right thing" for someone else.... the two most classified as "villians" by society.... now driven by the needs of others. Misunderstood? Misguided? You chooose, but I see both as totally redeemable.

Anyway, that's my kate take... I think this epi and podcast had lots of good stuff, foundational, if not pivital for big reveals. Have some other thoughts, will try to get them out before I get slammed on the above! ;-) (I'll be prepared to take it this time!)

2costa said...

sawyer probably came closest to dying when he was brought to the hatch by eko after the raft thing.

TheOtherLisa said...

Oh dear, that Kate post was long-- will try to make these succinct:

Is Kate replaying her mom's love triangle between Sgnt. Sam Austen and her mom? Is there significance in that? Do we know why the Sgnt and Diane divorced? How did wayne some into picture? (someone referesh me gently if that's an easy answer). I think Kate is at least made it far enough to have stopped Jack's advance before she left for Sawyer... maybe realizing he is not her responsibility to rescue.

Weird thought: How about the temple as a parrallel to the weed farm that Locke was at? He picked up a hitch-hiker (MIB, this time) and went to a place of communal living and enlightment.... in both settings he was a vehicle for the groups demise.

I think that the point of Sawyers change is to show that he was never a villian at heart anyway...

Alex as a parrallel to Aaron... what does Jacob really want done with the children (Ala Ben's convo with widmore upon kidnapping Alex)? Makes sense that Claire is now Rousseau... (what a crazy good observation about Rousseau's torture/test of Sayid, being like Dogens.... ) Did Rousseau sit in the cabin with Jacob, Christian, smokey...whoever, as Claire did after Alex was gone?

The baseball---was this part of Alpert's test to locke? If so... maybe the items he presented represented the 2 sides of the War. Locke's picks were correct... 2 were his, one was not his...at least before being "claimed"? (That one could be nothing but swiss cheese).

Somebody clarify: What year are they in in the temple? Cindy's there, so my assumption is post 815.... right? This would put Rousseau's death at the time we know it to be on the island right before the oceanic 6 left? If its 1977... I'm way confused.

Finally, I loved the sentiment that "nonsense" serves a purpose... and I don't believe we've ever seen a filler episode (ok...maybe Expose... but I wouldn't rule out some tidbit from there being important)

Done blubbering! ;p)

TheOtherLisa said...

So much for succinct!

maven said...

The baseball was not in Locke's test, but a baseball mitt was. Of course, baseball was mentioned a few times with the Red Sox winning the World Series. Someone somewhere pointed out that a baseball has 108 stitches on it!

Capcom said...

I like your thoughts about Kate TOL. You're right, she does do a lot of really great things for people and is often very helpful. I think that's why I have a hard time with her, because I'm not able in my head to put all of that constructive work that she does in tandem with the destructive actions, it all kind of zeroes out in the end. And I'm not sure that I'd want to be around someone like her on a deserted mystery island.

For me it goes beyond the fact that good/smart people do bad/dumb things and vice versa, etc. TPTB have made her so smart and savvy in so many critical respects, I just have a difficult time resolving the really big dumb things that she does. She obviously cares a lot for people to want to be so helpful all the time when there is trouble, but then the story has her knocking people off or out any time she wants to run. Would it kill her to stand up to her actions and take responsibility for once (rhetorical question)? It also bugs me that she doesn't stick to plans, I'm a loner and a rogue too, but when there's a plan or you give your word, you stick with it.

But that's the way she's written, and I just have to accept it (but I don't hafta like it). :o)

TheOtherLisa said...

Maven- thanks... swiss cheese in that one was even moldy! ;-) I thought someone clarified that, but took a shot anyway!

Capcom-- I get your frustration with Kate--- but I identify and enjoy her because I think she's a" true" character of human nature, flawed. I agree with you, wholeheartedly, however, on her running from her decisions/botched rescues... I cautiously hope we'll see that resolve. I see her and sawyer back at the temple in the knick of time.... for all the RIGHT reasons. (Yes, I've openly admitted the romantic in me... and the foolish part that always hopes for the best in others...)

Capcom said...

Me too, I really want to see her redeem herself overall. I really wanted that for Locke too dangitt, and it was totally true what Flocke said about Locke being so confused in his death and how sad that was. Now, Locke's mixed-upness I could see attributed to his being not altogether there mentally. His personality was all over the place, and he was not very stable from the beginning, poor guy.

Sayid'sgirl said...

theotherlisa
The time line on the island is 2007.
As far az filler episodes, Trisha Tanaka Is Dead is one of my favorite episodes.

TheOtherLisa said...

Capcom- Locke's confusion, for me at least was borne out of him being so willing and wanting to please, to have purpose, to have knowledge... somewhat also do the "right thing"- but in someone elses eyes? how often is "doing the right thing" so subjective for any of the characters (us)??? Up until the end, he thought he was... and truth is, we may find that he did/was!!! Crazy, isn't it? Only hindsight... Its what makes these conversations so engaging... and truth be told, "safe" for us to discuss the perils of human nature when we're talking about Locke/Flocke and Kate!;-) (Certainly not us, right? this blog could be quite a character story!!!)

To those frustrated with Kate's seeming lack of change-- i cite John Locke!!! Who never did learn!!! ;-) (Love Locke too... so don't call me a hater!)

SG- Thanks, the Rousseau thing makes much more sense to me now.

Takes a Village said...

MadAriad;
Congratulations on your new house.
Make sure it never gets underwater like "New Otherton".

Sayid'sgirl;
I sure hope you get your computer soon.
You could write the book "i-Phone Posting For Dummies.

I have never watched an episode of Lost I didn't like. It is probably because even though it may be a "centric" episode,there are so many little scenes with other characters,and sub plots,I am never dissapointed.
One man's filler can become another man's filet.

TheOtherLisa said...

TAV said...
One man's filler can become another man's filet.

LOVE IT! And I also agree, that anything "centric" usually has enough side stories... and ultimeately, I think we see of a connection to other characters (ex. Sayid on the TV in Sgt. Austin office....) that it all will come together.... ;-)

Capcom said...

Good thoughts on Locke, TOL, and I feel the same. To me he is/was a very tragic character in that he was so lost, and was trying so hard, and never seemed to be on the right track...or at least one that wasn't so crazazy over the top. It would be very neat if in the parallel time branch his character gets a little more satisfaction before things converge back into whatever is going to happen with their destiny. If he really did go on the walkabout in that timeline, I'd be very happy for him for that. He even seemed happy and at peace too.

TheOtherLisa said...

Capcom It would be very neat if in the parallel time branch his character gets a little more satisfaction

Agreed! I think he is/was a great character. If he wasn't so extreme in one direction (sad, pathetic, wanting to know, all consumed with his destiny, yet confused and looking to others to fill it) - his transformation would not be as shocking and noteworthy (genious writing and character development). I can only hope the same for all our Losties/Freighties and other others.... whether I love it or hate it, as long as each has a meaningful role and/or end I'll consider it more than sufficient in this spiders web!

And as Jack said, "Nothing is irreversible."

lost2010 said...

TOL - I read somewhere that the writers had a central characteristic that they associated with each character and that for Kate that characteristic was 'compassion'. That fits well with what you said.

And I thought that was borne out in both sides of the storyline. In one story, when the excitement of the chase is over, she feels compassion for Claire and goes back to help her. In the other side of the story, I think she really was worried about Sawyer. He's beaten down four Others, and killed another Other, and beaten around on Jack a while, and threatened to kill Jack - all in one day- he's not in a good place. I can sort of see why she didn't think it was a good idea for him to be alone.

2costa said...

i have a feeling locke is gonna kill himself in the sideways reality 2, or get killed. Just like aaron wasn't born early, in the last ep. I dont think there will be more satisfaction. The only thing that seems to change in the sideways is hurley's relationship with the numbers and his motivations, like he was in oz for recipee and not answers. I think part of why locke kept hurting his leg in the past was to keep him in a wheelchair and thus suicidal as per course correction. Shannon not being on the plane is the only other change i can see. I personally think her boyfriend is dharma or other, in the original she only goes with boone because the bf leaves her with the money, so he probably is like malkin, someway involved or else i can't really see why no swan causes him to stay with shannon. If the plane wasn't gonna crash then sayid didn't need the distraction of shannon, the puppetmasters of time must have thought. I also think christain's body warped off the sideways plane to the underwater island, like jack warped off the ajira plane

TheOtherLisa said...

lost2010-
I like that assigning of a central characteristic... if you ever remember where you read it, I'd love to as well. Characteristic assignment, if I'm reading MEL right, also fits a bit with what she's been saying. I think I take it perhaps to the point where each survivor is a central character, or unified figure collectively. I may be out of bounds... with that, but its a thought. Each having a role or a trait that makes the whole "team" (whichever team it is! and perhaps even set up their "nemisis" counterparts on the other team, whichever side of the war that is...).

Re compassion and rescue... fits quite nicely.
and she feels responsible for at least a portion of it (Juliette), thus, compassion magnified by responsiblity....needing to take it into her own hands and rescue... doesn't make her right all the time, thats for sure, but it does make her Kate, and, imo, an important character...evolving fast enough or not!

and for the record, the more i think about it ---my money is that Expose likely has a major , and I mean major, clue we missed.... how about, Jin was to see the older man for the diamonds that Nikki stole, and that's what Jins $ was for? Are the russian stacking dolls symbolic of each character removing their exteriors to get the the core, the diamond in the rough? Ok...getting cheesy... but it could be!

TheOtherLisa said...

2Costa said...
The only thing that seems to change in the sideways is hurley's relationship with the numbers....... I think part of why locke kept hurting his leg in the past was to keep him in a wheelchair and thus suicidal as per course correction.

I think the change in Hurley's relationship to the numbers, possibly changes everything. Its not little.

Your assessment of Locke seems to fit pretty well with the course correction theory.

I hope we find out what happened to Shannon!

lost2010 said...

The only thing I can glean from Expose, is that line where they said Mr. So-n-so was the Cobra all along!

LOST could be like that. We could discover that Character X was Smokey all along. . .

Oh wait, they sorta did that didn't they? ;)

TheOtherLisa said...

Lost 2010... re;cobra/smokey being right in front of us all along.... could be! Seriously though, given we know the writers asked for a timeline to complete the story well, I doubt there's any "filler". And if there is... I'm good with making it filet! (loved that)

I'm reading up on some connections elsewhere... just want to clarify... Do we know that Richard Malkin was Charlotte's father? And how?

lost2010 said...

I think he was Charlotte Malkin's father - not Daniel's Charlotte's father. . .

lost2010 said...

(There are some big spoilers/rumors floating around out there guys - I'm rumor-spoiled now, but thought I'd warn the rest of you to be careful.)

TheOtherLisa said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
TheOtherLisa said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
TheOtherLisa said...

That's right... the little girl who died (but really didn't?)... not even a redhead... thanks! I forgot all about it.

Thanks for warning... will be careful as I surf!

TheOtherLisa said...

A few posts ago, I had an idea to link Widmore to MIB (ex. they both want to go home, both possibly have a "team")--- here's another possible link from lostpedia:

"For unknown reasons, Ben cannot kill Widmore even when given the opportunity."

Maybe I had it in reverse--- or perhaps the rules work both ways. Or maybe, it was just little Charlie, and Ben's fondness for kids that stopped him on the boat. Perhaps Widmore and Ben are "types" of MIB and Jacob?

Anyway...that's digressing...

Sayid'sgirl said...

TAV
iPhone posting for dummies.
Thanks that made me lol. :) I've had a rather blah day. I don't think I'll have my computer back for tomorrow's show. I'm going to do my best to keep ip here anyway.

Thanks lost2010 so far I've actually managed not to hear or read any spoilers this week including the title of the episode.

mungonna said...

Interesting discussion on Kate there. I would have sworn Kate used the word " escape" 3 or 4 times in WKD.as in " escape, thats what I do".so..I'm sticking with Free Will,, sure,compassion is found with Free Will..but so are a lot of other things,,and those are what drive viewers batty. Just on a side note,,some irony..across the boards,,there are many nom de plumes suggesting a relationship with a male character..SayidsGirl, you mite know what I'm talking about. Yet,,when a character in Lost actually fulfills that bit of wishful thinking with two of the leading male characters..well now..what a so and so she is. It just cracks me up. Same with the Jater Skater rivalry...geesh,,,if any would actually exercise their free will everytime a boyfriend got stupid...oh my.. god forbid....I suppose there is where I have problem with Kate being Compassion...She walks everytime either Jack or Sawyer gets Stupid..btw of being possessive,,or thinking for her,,or etc etc etc..Heck,,even marriage and it compromises was too confining for Kate..no..shes a free bird who has learned it don't mean a thing..if ya can't share it. Think about it..she couldn't share it with Hubbie cuz he was a ...
Another side note..that whole scene with the auto mechanic..no body has talked about it..but what a little pearl it is..Its more than.. this is how Kate got the handcuffs off..They could have done that with a 2 second gun shot scene,,The guy would have done it for her for free..but she approached him all wrong from the start. A little time with the mirror and..That little lesson turned her around...Small, but what a gem! Again ..its the little scenes and seemingly insignificant dialogue..where there is much of LOST.

Every episode of Lost has worked for me. The visual metaphors,,double entendre' dialogue, alludes to philosophers, artists et al,,Segues making bridges between the Island and flashes.. ,,thematic detection or " finding Breton" all brings me to an aspect of myself and fellow human beings. Every Episode of Lost has done it.

I am the first one to say and admit,,I don't get it all on first pass,,even 2nd pass or third. I do live in the real world and sometimes it just creates barriers hard to see around or over. Thats the whole purpose of boards, blogs and chats..Finding a place to set your attention free,,and see what you missed. Communication places are also spawning grounds..where inputs creates a new realization..Art is made. To me..that is the Hope of all these blogs boards and chats..We all bring what we bring..but if we walk away with something nobody brought..thats magnificent!

MEL

Sayid'sgirl said...

TOL
I've wondered if the reason Ben and Widmore can't kill each other is because they were both leaders of fhe island.

I wonder why Ben told Danielle that if she ever wanted to see Alex again that anytime she heard whispers to run the other way? If Jacob is the good guy and is associated wirh the temple people, why run?

mungonna said...

Characters not able to kill each other..two sides of the same coin...kill one side means kill the coin...Jack and Locke could not kill each other...Wid and Ben could not kill each other...AAAH!..but,,a repentant Ben could kill Jake..Perhaps the last gasp of MIB LOcke will be at the hands of a " repentant "..Wid...I smell a wolf in sheeps clothing there...but then again..I see how Madison Avenue has embraced The Surreal in its advertising and what not..so..it could happen.

MEL

Capcom said...

Good question SG!

Speaking of Kate, someone on Bigmouth's blog mentioned and reminded me of some differences in the cab scene in context to things that Kate says to Claire and the cabbie, between the first time it's shown and the second time in last week's ep. I had completely forgotten about that over the weekend, I meant to compare the two scenes to make sure that I wasn't imagining it. I wonder what that is about?!

mungonna said...

Cap..that really isn't new is it..changing slitely the same scene?..Remember back to the first two episodes of season 2...? Same event,,just seen from another perspective.?......we're brought back to the notion of subjectivity....or.. as Mike Emerson asks on Soup...define reality...

just thinking of that skit makes me laff..for real!!
MEL

Twinkle said...

I haven't seen anyone use this nickname on here but I didn't check thoroughly either.

Scifi Wire just called Flocke the "Locke-ness Monster!" Too funny!

Capcom said...

Right Mel, but to have it happen now in the ATL is just too much for my brain to handle. X-O

I totally agree with you Mel about how discussion of art heightens and enlightens the artistic experience beyond the art itself, etc. Lost blogs have always reminded me of online literary salons. While we aren't exactly reading to each other, the discussions are emotionally fulfilling, and entertaining as well as educational. Wiki: A salon is a gathering of intellectual, social, political, and cultural elites under the roof of an inspiring hostess or host, partly to amuse one another and partly to refine their taste and increase their knowledge through conversation. These gatherings often consciously following Horace's definition of the aims of poetry, "either to please or to educate".

Sayid'sgirl said...

capcom
I could be wrong but I think it's just the way they recap. They did the same thing last season when Ben woke up and seen Locke was alive. It was a little different from the end of one episode to the begining of the next.

A thought I had was only the leader of the island could kill Jacob. Ben was the leader because Locke was dead. Richard told MIB "There can only be one leader on the island at a time. " Ben was the reason MIB was able to go into the foot to see Jacob.

mungonna said...

..back to the 108 stitches on a baseball,,,I got a" Dogen is worried" from that baseball bit...now I see the link,,,back to the count down clock..Dogen is running out of time,,and he knows it.

mungonna said...

which reminds me...has there been a Muppet parody of LOST yet? and if not,,should there be one? Kermit as Dogen seems soooo rite...or is it Dogen as Kermit?

MEL

2costa said...

i heard Smocke too

lost2010 said...

Kate doesn't show Jack and Sawyer a whole lot of compassion, true. Good point.

I tried to find the article again but didn't have any luck. . .in that article they identified Kate with compassion, Juliet with Love, Sawyer with Revenge, and so on. . .since I'm stuck in a hotel room this week I guess I'll have plenty of time to see if I can track it down again.

Ack Attack is up, if you're up for a non-compassionate look at the episode. It's hilarious as always.

:)

ObFuSc8 said...

mungonna said...
which reminds me...has there been a Muppet parody of LOST yet? and if not,,should there be one? Kermit as Dogen seems soooo rite...or is it Dogen as Kermit?


There is the Muppet Pierre Chang they have doing the LOST untangled bits. He has a fan page on FB as well.

regret said...

I haven't seen any parody so far but now will definitely search for one. It will be good watch a parody based upon lost episodes that will be a new dimension all together to watch out for.

Zort70 said...

Happy LOST day to all

Sayid'sgirl said...

Happy Lost Day LoCos!

ChrisL said...

Happy LOST day all!

Had fun reading through loads of posts and have to say I'm with MEL. Never been disappointed in an episode yet. I can't find it in myself to be as the more I re-watch the more I discover in every one.

Enjoy the show and pity those that have to wait an extra 24 hours!

Sayid'sgirl said...

Hi Chris
I've never been disappointed in an episode of Lost,
but there have been episodes that i've enjoyed more than others. I think you can say that about any series.
See you in 24+ hours. :)

Amy Lynn said...

Morning, guys. Happy LOST day. I got spoiled on the title and character-centric parts of this eppy, and have super high expectations.

ChrisL said...

Amy. I don't even know the title! How cool is that to have avoided all spoilers! Keeping my fingers in my ears and my eyes closed for the next 24hrs.

mungonna said...

..a small question..only remotely spoilirsh...has Sawyer ever had a run in with Smokie?..My memory has nothing on that...I'm not recalling Sawyer every running away or fouling his pants with Smokie...If he did, let me know. If he hasn't..very interesting.

MEL

ChrisL said...

Hmmmm... MEL... where are you going with that I wonder? I don't remember Sawyer coming FTF with Smokie.

maven said...

Happy Lost Day on a beautiful Tuesday!

I, too, know the title and which character is centric. I don't consider that that info spoils me.

I can't remember Sawyer ever have a direct contact with Smokey.

Amy Lynn said...

I do seem to remember Sawyer SEEING Smokey at some point very late in the game, and asking what the hell it was, but I don't think they've ever been face to face.

maven said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
maven said...

FYI: For those who read Vozzek69's great recaps at DarkUFO...recently the news was posted that his house completely burned down. All his family got out fine and are safe. Currently they are living in a trailer on their lot and rebuilding has begun. He has a great support group helping them out.

Good thoughts go out to him and his family!

Ellen said...

Finally got caught up on the 2000+ emails in my inbox and finished my first blogpost this new season! Wow, just in time too! It's so good to be here, and I will be a bit more regular at commenting from now on. I'll see all of you after the show tonight!
xxoo

ChrisL said...

Hey Ellen, good to see you and read your blog!

Unbelievable, after managing to remain spoiler free AliceL (daughter, 10) just spoiled me with the title of tonights ep. DOH!

Enjoy it everyone.

Sayid'sgirl said...

They're re airing last week's episode before tonight's episode. It doesn't say but it will probaably have pop ups.

Amy Lynn said...

Yes, it will have pop ups. It's Hollywood week on Idol, though.

LostIt said...

MEL,

I don't see Ben as being repentant in any way shape or form. I see him sliding further down the slope into the abyss of selfishness. And don't say he's exercising free will because he's not. He's been manipulated into doing the bidding of Old Smokey. Not free or repnentant IMO.

maven said...

Congrats to Lost2010 for being #1 for the TLC team in the LFL!

Sayid'sgirl said...

The LFL stats are up for those interested.

Sayid'sgirl said...

I see maven already posted it. I had to stop to clean up the mess my cat made. lol

maven said...

Carlton tweeted this a while ago:
"Don't miss tonight's episode. A number of things are illuminated."

@SG: I spend quite a while yesterday cleaning up cat throw-up in the garage!

Melissa_Lossa said...

Hey, everyone - I've just been looking through some photos for the post tonight, and I am now VERY excited. That's all I'll say.

Also exciting - I have a 2nd interview tomorrow. Wish me luck!

maven said...

Good luck, ML!

Sayid'sgirl said...

Good Luck Melissa.
maven if you're still around could you tell me where I placed in LFL? It's taking me forever to find it. :)

Amy Lynn said...

@maven, re: Carlton's tweet about "things being illuminated". Does that mean we find out things, or that the entire episode is Jack and Kate setting stuff on fire?

futureself said...

Evening Locos! Just caught up on last night and todays posts.

Well I've never been disappointed in an episode either and you can question my taste if you like but I loved Expose!

I have got a hell of a lot out of the cerebral entwining of Lostonians and feel greatly indebted to you all for the stimulation and lack of sleep.

Lost Muppets...surely Dogan would have to be Miss Piggy (karate chopping Jack and being dramatic and the center of attention), Lennon is Fozzie Bear (the '[she] never really had a sense of humour' line would work with Fossie and him continually stuffing up his translations), Jack is of course Kermit, Gonzo is Sawyer and Animal is Sayid! Kate can be guest star and play herself....I'm thinking about this way too much!!!

I think AmyLynn is right and Sawyer only caught a glimpse of Smokie once, but he did hear the whispers a few times (when he was on his boar vendetta)...

Ben Ben Ben...I still hang to a thread of fantasy that he is still manipulating the situation. I recently, when reading up on Twilight Zone episodes, discovered 'Crazy as a Soup Sandwich', about a con guy who is tricked into a contract to give up his soul by a demon (who first appears to him as a colourful cloud).

He seeks help from Nino, a man who he is owe a lot of money to, who agrees to help him. People die, the demon chases them back to Nino's warehouse where Nino demands the demon cancel the contract for the conman's soul. The demon laughs at him but Nino uses an ancient relic to weaken the demon and force him into a stone box. It is revealed that Nino defeated the demons father before using the same box. Now Nino wants the conman to make a deal....

The narrator ends the episode with this:

"Making a deal with a demon is seriously crazy. But making a deal with a master of demons, well, that's crazy as a soup sandwich"

Amused2bHere said...

happy Lost day locos

has everyone seen the contest at Cafepress? you have until this Thurs to get your designs in...

see y'all after the episode tonight!

Sayid'sgirl said...

futureself
How ironic. You choose my favorite muppet animal to be my favorite character Sayid. :)

maven said...

SG: You're 7th from the bottom in TLC (I'm 5th and Memphish is 6th). Now DetroitBlueHeron is in first (they must have updated it). Your current rank overall is #2087.

Sayid'sgirl said...

Thanks maven.

2costa said...

sawyer witnessed smokey whooping keamy's ass at newotherton

i think ben knows more then he let's on, just like he had them build a runway on hydra island, probably so the ajira plane would survive to take off again or at least so he would survive the landing.

i just wonder if Ben actually thought locke was going to come back to life like he played it off when he saw john was alive. Why else did he give jack that st. thomas speech in the lighthouse.

2costa said...

maybe smokey was never judging anyone maybe he was scanning them to see if they would make a proper avatar?

2costa said...

maybe smokey was never judging anyone maybe he was scanning them to see if they would make a proper avatar?

TheOtherLisa said...

Happy Lost Day too... I have to second all the comments about enjoying these discussions to get through the week. I know I'm not one to have more than swiss cheese to bring to the table, so I've enjoyed learning too. (How you guys catch some of the stuff you do is beyond me! Its like a second viewing!)

maven said...

I'll be checking here if any pop-ups reveal something earth shattering! Between American Idol and the Olympics...it's a touch night. The good thing (I guess) is NBC seems to be putting the ice skating on after 10pm pst (I was watching the Pairs up to midnight last night!). So I'll be able to catch up after Lost airs!

Takes a Village said...

Happy Lost Day.
Had to work late;reading comments.

lost2010 said...

Hey all! Ready to watch Lost - I think. Just have to finish the things I'm supposed to get done today because my brain will be mush after LOST - always is.

Yay for my LFL team - I'm not sure how it's doing well with Jack getting beaten up in every episode but I don't guess I'll look a gift horse in the mouth. lol

Just Thinking said...

Oh they are tricky- Kate recognizes Jack...because she bumped into him on the plane!

Just Thinking said...

(That was the pop up)

maven said...

Thanks, JT...seems they're downplaying the deja vu thing?

maven said...

^^^^^^
That was #108!

maven said...

The ODI tweeted that Canada aired Lost earlier because of Olympics...so our neighbors to the north have seen it already! Be careful out there!

Sayid'sgirl said...

maven
Congrats on 108!

Sayid'sgirl said...

Maven
I seen thar on Twitter earlier today. Can't remember who tweeted it.

maven said...

Anything else interesting in the pop-ups?

Melissa_Lossa said...

Not really, maven.

NEW POST!

Just Thinking said...

Well- the people Dogen mentions Jack being responsible for in the pop up are Christian, Charlie and Juliet. Kind of surprised Christian was in there- as Dogen was talking about people who helped Jack and got hurt.