Tonight, Jack questions Locke's motives after he's asked to perform a tough task.
Personally, I'd be WAY past questioning Locke's motives, but this is Jack we're talking about.
And who wouldn't trust a guy holding a package marked "explosives"? Just look at that smile!
Tuesday, May 04, 2010
The Candidate - Season 6, Episode 13
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«Oldest ‹Older 201 – 276 of 276taller walt had to be real too, because mib can't become live people. Which seems to show when the island healed locke' gunshot wound and had walt give him a peptalk he was still working for jacob. Killing Naomi and trying to not let the freightys come would have averted all this mess we have seen as well. At the same time if widmore had extracted Ben with the freighter team, there would be no Ben on the island to kill Jacob, so who knows.
just as christian that told vincent to go to jack in the missing pieces wasn't smokey. "youve got work to do" seems to be the catchphrase of people that aren't on team smokey. taller ghost walt was trying to help locke avert the freighter touching down off the island. Like i said before if Faraday, never got to the island, he never would have had the info in the past from desmond and the numbers from the rocket experiment, to safely make it to the island in the first place
marty mcfly reference - always funny.
so cooper and locke is post kidney relationship? i cant imagine him getting in a plane with him unless he was already nice after the kidney
that sounds right bigdog, post kidney. Even though cooper is much better to locke. Locke was still fatherless or his last name would be cooper. We know Cooper still swindled sawyer's parents. Locke and cooper were super close, when he taught him about hunting and such.
I am starting to wonder if all the weird course corrections in the sideways are a result of jack messing with the timeline, not sideways jack, but jack from island time that has become jacob. Just as MIb seems to favor characters that have mommie issues, like claire, and ben has a soft spot for kids, jack as the new jacob would concentrate on daddy issues, so his tweaks to the timeline that we know of as the sideways often give much better father/son outcomes. I think the question becomes if jack becomes the new jacob, will he go back in time and change things from there or does he start meddling with the timeline from 2004 or 2007 on into the future. It seems to me if jack become Jacob and only messes with stuff form 2004 on, then aaron and sun's kid will be in play in the future, but not on the show.
@ Zort-it does seem that we know their goals at least now- MIB to escape and Jacob to get the candidate in place.
Bigdog- as I said- think Claire's "falling star" song on the music box was meant to connect her to the island timeline- where she knew Christian and was familiar with the song.
jin seemed like what he did was commiting suicide, so i wonder if sun was really the candidate?
Have we ruled out the possibility that the "Kwon" candidate is actually Ji Yeon? Everyone on the island can die, and one candidate remains safely away from Flocke.
I don't think Ji Yeon is the Kwon in question. MiB said that "some" of the candidates were dead. Sayid is not "some", he's just one.
My memory is bad. If I am remembering correctly, didn't Claire ask if they were all dead... to which Flocke replied "not all of them"?
Seems to me, if I got the wording right, that could just mean he knows his plan didn't work... like he could sense if the last candidate died, since that would free him.
@Steve, hmmm... that might be right.
I still don't think Ji Yeon is a candidate, though. She wasn't even conceived when the names were written on the wall.
Fair enough. Assuming that we have a reasonable guess as to when the wall list was written. Jack's name seemed written over another name in the lighthouse. Who is to say the list is even static?
Yes, I am grasping at straws. I'd hate to let any possibility slip past us without consideration. I agree it is unlikely, but Ji Yeon should have a more important role in the story, otherwise she is just a building block for two deceased characters back-stories, and ultimately a screen-time waster.
JT - i didnt recognize the song at all. i thought the box itself was the connection.
Word to the wise (ie, not me). Do not Google around for the title of 6.17. Holy spoiler cow.
Whatever you do,don't look at the sneak peek over at ABC.
I thought it was going to be the
short video after the candidate aired. Yikes.
The spoiler free world gets smaller and smaller- reduced to just here I think.
I'm kind of resigned to hearing everything I don't want to at the J&J party before the finale-don't know how to block it out with a couple of thousand Lost fans on every side!
2c I hope you are right about Kate's uncrossed out lighthouse name! I like your theory about the Others being part of "training" the 815ers for the final battle. Great point, @ Jin can't kill himself,& perhaps Sun (or JiYeon) was the candidate. Agreed with all who were hoping for JiYeon's mention.
Agreed that if Sawyer hadn't touched the bomb it would not have gone off, like the dynamyte- but I also think the bomb would have had to stay in range of Sawyer. Perhaps if Sayid hadn't gone running out with the bomb, it wouldn't have gone off, because Sawyer couldn't kill himself, but he COULD kill Sayid (or others). There's been nothing so far to say that one candidate can't kill another, right? Capcom, your Keamy and Michael thing.. hmmmm...Keamy wasn't a candidate? maybe that matters...
SG- At least it was a noble demise for your hero! Though, this mirrored the looking glass a bit... so I wonder if Sayid is about as dead as patchy was!
Knew Sayid didn't kill Des!
I didn't see how Lapidis died?
Lostit, I thought also that Locke was going to turn around when jack said, "I wish you'd believed me!" Maybe that's the memory Des was trying to spark!
2c- wow about the pilot's license. If Flocke channels bits of of Locke, we now also know that Locke's got one too (and that is what injured his father, so somewhat WHH, but in reverse?). I didn't get that significance till you mentioned Jack....of course Locke would want them to blow up the sub, because he intends to fly out the plane, which makes sense that now he wanted to be in Locke's body with Locke's background.
With all your iterations talk 2c, the best I can understand it is like cheating on the old Choose Your Own Adventure books, till you got the ending you wanted! (and i totally forgot the jack in thailand ep! very jacob esque!)
Big Dog, I'd love to see Claire take MIB out and get her baby back!
If the same Cooper as Locke's dad and Sawyer's parent's con-man exists, boy, what a spin when Sawyer finds him.
Goodness... there's still Faraday, Rose, and Bernard to deal with....Des, Miles, Alpert... all of those people running around in the jungle (there's still a Cindy, Zach and Emma....), perhaps we need more than just a half hour added! (Disconcerting that the added half hour comes at the 11th hour)
Can someone tell where the idea came from that the candidates can't kill themselves?
I think there's a difference in the island not being done with you like Michael and who and how the candidates can be killed.
As far as I know Richard has been the only one to say he can't kill himself and I don't think he's a candidtate. I think Jack not dying with Richard had to do with Jack's faith and the fact that he is going to be Jacob's replacement. Not that Jack as a candidate can't kill himself. And according to the jungle boy MIB can't kill them. Maybe MIB needs a different loophole to kill the candidates. Like conning them into killing each other. As soon as Sawyer touched the bomb it was his action not MIB's that was doing the killing.
I could be wrong but here's my wacky theory. MIB quit trusting Sayid. He knows Sayid can disarm a bomb. I think his intentions were for Sayid to disamrn the bomb which would kill them all. Either way though Sayid or Sawyer the bomb went off. I don't think MIB expected Sayid to sacrafice himself for his friends. But I do think Jacob thought he might. Which is what he was pondering before he told Hurley he had to save Sayid's life and to take him to the temple.
I know it's a stretch but hey it's Sayid. He'll always be my favorite character. :)
Grrr ...tell me...
Hey SG-
I don't think that your theory above is much of a stretch... obviously, there was a reason Sayid was important/to be saved per Jacob.
I guess re: candidates not killing themselves- for me its a conglomeration of stuff from the Michael stuff, TNT, to the boy in the Jungle to the loophole. But, I guess perhaps, in my case, I may be buying into hype that isn't well founded.
I think Richard was a candidate at some time. Jack lighting the dynamite and it not going off, sort of led to the logical leap that candidates can't kill themselves, since Richard has apparently tried to kill himself. Jacob doesn't go around touching everyone. We also saw that jacob touched all of the valanzetti number candidates and Kate, so it's not really that big a leap to think candidates are touched by jacob and Richard is a candidate that has been crossed of for whatever reason. Ironically locke couldn't have killed himself so ben had to do it. Perhaps the island wasn't done with mike, just as Ben killed locke, keamy killed mike, the island doesnt protect candidates form being killed. RClaire and Boone were both candidates and they died pretty easily. They have never said it m but i think only candidates can kill other candidates. ROusseau and Linus are candiate names, maybe ben said wodmore borke the rules because you cazn't even kill maybe candidates, like smokey couldn't kill sun or jin because he didn't know which was the candidate. SO perhaps Ben thought alex couldn't be killed because her last name was on the cave wall so widmore couldn't know if she was a candidate or not.
Ben saying "the island is done with you" and Christian on the freighter saying it, and that had to real christian imo, makes me think Ben and christian are working together. That would also explain why Ben didn't go into the cabin with Locke when christian and Claire were in there. Where as widmore and hawkings both are known to say" the island isn't done with you".
jacob also touched richard right as he asked to live forever, so unless jacob is a genie that grants wishes, it's not to off to think that the touch brings on the non aging. Considering jacob's candidates need to be able to live forever or a long unnatural life to perform the duty's of jacob. With price,pickett, and friendly all being candidates, i don't doubt that mikhail was a candidate and that's why he lived through so much. It also explains why MIkhail had to shoot klugh instead of her shooting herself if she was a candidate.
i was thinking that perhaps in the last iteration of the timeline before lost 1.0. The whole end game we are seeing now happened in 2004 instead of 2007, the oceanic six leaving forestalled the end game for three years this time. Perhaps the oceanic six or not all of them at least never went back to the island the first time around and then smokey won anyway. Not because of his loophole plan, but because jack or one of the oceanic six were the true candidate and never going back still led to mib winning because jacob exhausted all of his candidates. So the reason hawkings said "for the first time in a long time i don't know what's going to happen" at the hospital after desmond was shot was because the last time around not all of the 06 or none of them didn't go back to the island.
even without the timeloop mib could have gotten to jacob, using locke. SOmeone would have killed locke on the island at some point. Ben tried. Jack pulled the trigger on locke but the gun wasn't loaded. MIb could have assumed his form then. Even without the compass thing and mib. Locke would have seemed very special on the island since he could walk again, without mib timeloop meddling. So i could see a path to be the leader of the others for locke timeloop or not.
rclaire should have said shannon above
Jay and Jack's contest has announced the finalists: http://globalcashcard.com/lost/
I don't have time to watch the videos now, but can't wait!
Do you have to sign up for you tube for your vote to count?
i was watching the one where locke turned the donkey wheel and the well looked a lot different then the one flocke threw desmond into. The donkey wheel well had a whole rope and spool thingy. There was also these big stones around the donkey well that looked like stonehenge or the monument where locke was supposed to kill cooper. The donkey well was also much deeper. I assume there are a lot of stripped down like the desmond well, where the people that built them realized they were in the wrong spot.
I hope they answer what richard was talking about, when he told locke in 1955, he had privileged information about how to get off the island. Was the donkey wheel the only way to leave the island before there was a dharma sub. It seems there has to be another way to come and go from the island. If richard used the donkey wheel, he would lose time in the real world every time he turned it. To go see locke's birth, he would probably not come back to the island for at least a year if the donkey wheel was the mode of transport.
In 2007 Richard and Ben know how important it is to trap mib, otherwise either one of them could leave the island easily by turning the donkey wheel. I think they aren't considering that because it would foul up jacob's master plan.
I wonder if TPTB will ever tell us why MIB can't just turn the wheel and leave the island. Must be a "rule" for that too.
I wish we can find the box lid that has all the rules printed on it! :)
Wishing all the TLC Mommies a Happy Mother's Day!
@Capcom, wouldn't that fall under the same rule of him not being able to leave because of Jacob/the Candidates being alive?
I haven't been following the ins and outs of this discussion, so forgive me if I'm repeating what someone else has said. I like the idea that MIB's "home" is actually on Island, but that he can only access it once he gets rid of all these annoying candidates. I think there's some evidence that is not the case. E.g. when Richard arrives he seems to be the only living "normal" person on the Island, so why isn't MIB satisfied then? Hopefully we will get a good idea of the rules next week.
I also heard a podcaster discussing that Jacob may have misled MIB about what the rules actually are. Another sort of long con. So much like the Losties and us the viewers MIB is to some extent playing the wrong game. I'm not sure we've got enough time left to investigate something like this, but it's at least an interesting idea.
I dunno Amy. Nothing that I've seen makes much sense in my head about right now.
If it's so dangerous to move the island, maybe MIB could do like the old "Sit And Spin" toy and just spin and spin till the island broke up into pieces and then he could escape. :-D
I'm curious about a theory that the island is actually MIB's home, Memphish. Is that as in, the island is some kind of vehicle or abode that used to be someplace else besides on earth, and he want's to take it back there?
I still can't help thinking about MIB in terms of General Zod from Superman (from the movie, I have no idea what Gen.Zod did in the comics).
I'm with you memphis, in that i don't think mib wants to physically leave the island. I tend to think that home for mib is referring to a time period not a place. If you were a thousand years "after your time" or whatever then the present wouldn't be home. When Ben was about to kill Jacob, flocke said "things will change", I took that to mean the timeline. I think Mib has to kill all the candidates and then sink the island or something in order to erase Jacob's influence on the timeline. Perhaps since Mib can't turn the wheel himself He needs to get a recruit to do it, but only after everyone else is dead on the island. Then the recruit would be in tunesia and mib would be alone and able to stop the events that led to him being trapped as the smoke and perhaps prevent his mother from becoming insane. I think that Mib needs a recruit to do something just like jacob needs a candidate to do something, but who don't know what that something is.
I like that idea about home being the right place in time 2Costa. That would be cool, and would certainly go with all of our time displacement in S5 and you can argue in the current S6 stories as well.
Happy Mothers Day to all the LoCo Moms!
happy mother's day
did anyone see the budlight commercial with pierre chang and radzinsky, it looked like almost lost themed
Happy Day TLC moms!
Happy Mother's Day! And happy 2 days until the final "normal" episode of LOST!!!
If you read the British listings magazines, be careful about reading the next episode description.
"Normal episode" seems to be a subjective term, which I suppose sums LOST up :-)
Just popping in to wish all us TLC Mommies Happy Mother's Day! A lot of issues with Mother's, too, on LOST!
@Zort, LOL. I was just referring to the fact that the writer's usually include the episode before the finale as Finale, Part 1 of 3 in their long range plan. Don't know if that's the case this year, but I assume so.
Happy Mother's Day LoCo Mom's!
I just found this on Lostpedia and thought it was worth a looksie.
Desmond to Ruth in "Catch-22"
DESMOND:
"OK, yes, I was scared about the wedding, so I had a few pints too many, maybe I, I raised my eyes, and I asked am I doing the right thing? And that's the last thing I remember, and when I woke up, I was lying on my back in the street, and I dunno how I got there and, there was this man standing over me, Ruth. And he reached out his hand and he said to me, "can I help you brother?" And the first thing I noticed was the rope tied round his waist, and I looked at him and I knew, I knew, I was supposed to go with him. I was supposed to go with him, I was supposed to leave everything that mattered behind, sacrifice all of it, for a greater calling."
And her response:
RUTH: Well its a good thing a bloody shepherd didn't help you up, or as I suppose you'd be off with the sheep wouldn't you? Next time you want to break up with someone, Des, don't join a monastery. Just tell the girl you're too bloody scared.
that was brother campbell that was standing over him, we know hawkings was in the pic with campbell. campbell is a candidate name from the wall and lighthouse. it seems like former island people that leave the island, are partly like support staff for jacob off island. Interesting that reynolds was a candidate, and that the name of the principle at ben's school in the sideways, i think candidates are all over the outside world.
in the life and death of jeremy bentham, widmore knew all this stuff about the island,locke,the freighter and the future, but he was wrong about something. he told locke that ben tricked him into exile and assumed that ben had also tricked john into exile. john was like no ben was already gone by that time. widmore knew ben had already left the island, so it just looks like widmore was conning locke, but i think there is something more. i think in a previous iteration of the timeline ben did trick locke into exile, but it ended the same way with mib winning, so this time around ben chose to leave first and do all his assasinations with sayid off island. This also seems to fit with all the time richard visited locke when he was a kid. If locke had chosen to go with richard in high school ben would have never become the leader at all. This goes back to widmore telling ben. "i know who u are and what u are" That version of widmore he was talking to had ruled the island for 30 years in peace and then had passed the reigns to locke. Somehow ben tricked locke off the island after that. ben was obviously injected into the timeline by horus like widmore injected desomnd into the timeline.
i also think that jacob wanted sayid to work for ben, otherwise why did he touch him and let nadia die, chronilogically ben met in iraq about a week after jacob touched sayid. Jacob didn't touch hurley until 2 years after that. jacob was probably juist setting up the sayid shooting young ben thing all along to ensure ben got his chance to be the leader of the others. where as in the previous iteration of the timeline little ben would meet richard, but the 815'ers never would travel back there so ben would never be shot or healed at the temple.
@2costa, yeah, I know that it was the monk, just thought it was interesting, that Des seemed to have been offered the same thing that Dogen was, by someone NOT Jacob/MiB.
i've been saying with the island sunken in the sideways l.a. has acted like a proxy for the island. hawkings did say that under the lamp post station was a pocket of electro magnetic energy similar to the ialand. that seems to show how l.a. is such a hot spot of island activity in the sideways. It also shows how jack's home could be seen in the lighthouse. perhaps the 360 spots on the wheel correspond to hotspots across the globe.
i dont see where cambell offered him anything there though
@2costa, I was referring to this:
" I was supposed to leave everything that mattered behind, sacrifice all of it, for a greater calling."
he's referring to the preisthood
@2costa, yes, I understand. What I was saying was that without the context of you having SEEN Catch 22, the situations sound remarkably similar.
If I could go off on rewatch points-
Jack offering to have Claire stay with him was a big deal because Claire's big issue is abandonment. Christian goes, her Mom is in a coma, her boyfriend leaves. She trusts Flocke because he is the only one who didn't abandon her. Is she going to keep Aaron or abandon him? So Jack offering to include her is very important for resolving her issue.
Locke's plan to blow the sub seems pretty rickety unless he has foreknowledge of events. He got the watch at the last minute. Again-he must have had c4 or known it was there. What if Jack had not taken off his pack just as they got to the sub, and what if they had not looked in the pack so Sawyer could fiddle with the bomb?
Lots of ways for the plan to go wrong.
About the backpacks- now we know why Jack swam back from the Elisabeth with that pack on- he had to for the story. Normally-weight in a pack would make you - umm- sink.
And when Locke goes after the survivors in the end-did I see that he STILL has "the pack". So maybe he did not switch with Jack, but just put the bomb in Jack's pack. We still don't know what he has there!
JT, I think what we are seeing is the usual deal with the devil scenario where you ask for what you want but get something that is twisted. e.g. Sayid wanting Nadia to be alive, she is alive but he can't be with her.
If Claire is included in Jack's life will she loose something else that is important ?
Happy belated mothers Day to you all!
Zort- seems like it should be obvious what the f/side is by now- but I still don't know. I still can't put together- sunken island, deal with devil, redemption, this isn't real and mirror world. We need some more Desmond I guess.
@JT, I am frustrated by that, as well. We were supposed to have figured out the point to the f/sideways by midseason, but I still don't know, and I have little hope of ever figuring it out for sure
i think that matt fox saying the sideways would only last half the season was a foiler obviously
the true nature of the sideways and what it all means is going to be answered definitively by the end of the show
@2costa, I think even if Damon and Carlton bought an hour of airtime and explained the FSideways after the finale, we'd still be debating it. LOL!
agreed, we will still have questions and theories, but hopefully less than now
Interesting points about Catch22 Amy. And, heheh, shepherd/Shepherd, quite curious there as well.
Belated Happy Mother's Day.
Mothers are awesome.
It seems that LU will offer a Masters Program, per Dark UFO.
http://darkufo.blogspot.com/2010/05/lost-university-post-graduate-course.html
Interesting that reynolds was a candidate, and that the name of the principle at ben's school in the sideways,
Wow! Nice catch 2c!
JT- in this timeline Claire said she'd never even met her father... maybe mum isn't in a coma? (I like where you are going though)
AL- the making a sacrifice connection for Des is quite interesting, as is leaving love at the altar... perhaps, he'll be asked to leave Pen and the coffee shop....
I've not gone back and re-watched any of these, but its my hope, just like you guys are finding that when I do... we'll have such a well written end that starting in season 1 we are all collectively sighing (or screaming) "I can't believe I didn't see that!"
Heads up! TeeFury is going to be selling an Ab Aeterno shirt in 20 minutes!
Read this on DarkUFO and thought it might be of interest:
We are excited to announce LOST-A-THON (http://lostathon.com), a charity event and Guinness World-Record attempt centered around ABC’s primetime drama, LOST. Beginning at 12:47 AM on May 20, Mike Berlin, Alex Green, and Aaron Rosenthal will attempt to watch every episode of LOST back to back (approximately 94 hours), culminating with the live series finale airing on May 23 at 9:00 PM EST.
LOST-A-THON’s goal is to raise awareness of and generate $100,000 in donations for three great charities: The Christopher & Dana Reeve Foundation, Doctors Without Borders, and The Nature Conservancy. In the process of completing this endeavor, we will earn a new Guinness World Record for the longest television watching marathon ever (the current record is 86 hours).
LOST-A-THON is taking place at Professor Thom’s bar at 219 2nd Avenue in New York City. We are planning live coverage of the event through an internet stream, with updates also posted to our website, http://lostathon.com and Twitter feed- http://twitter.com/lostathon.
We are looking for your support to gain additional media coverage of the event to help achieve our fund raising goals. Contact information and availability are included below, and additional information about donations, sponsors, the schedule, and the LOST-A-THON background, can be found at lostathon.com
Visit our MEDIA page stocked with LOST-A-THON images and information- http://lostathon.com/contact-us/media/
Charity Links:
Christopher and Dana Reeve Foundation: http://www.christopherreeve.org
Doctors Without Borders: http://www.doctorswithoutborders.org/
The Nature Conservancy: http://www.nature.org
A limited number of interview opportunities are available during the event and will be granted on a first come, first serve basis. Please email lostathon@gmail.com for more information.
Thanks in advanced for your support.
Sincerely,
LOST-A-THON Creators
Happy 2nd to last Tuesday LOST Day! Boo-hoo!
Happy LOST Day!
Happy LOST Day. I have a feeling it's going to be a good one!
damon said this in an interview, any ideas what in the world this could mean?
"There might, possibly, be some questions that we, as storytellers, will answer in the body of the show that might not be appearing in the finale. And that's all we're willing to say ..."
confused?
@2costa, by "body of the show" is he talking about LOST, LOST Live, Jimmy Kimmel, or something else? It's hard to tell from that little quote.
Aha, I found the interview here BEWARE SPOILERS!:
http://www.lost.com/forum/showthread.php?s=09726ef3b3e4afb0776437baf940480e&p=403143#post403143
Happy Lost Day.
It is a specially happy one for me.
LFL stats are in.I clawed my way up to 2nd.(totally picked with my gun this season).
I bow down to ib4uc, as our leader.
I am so spoilerphobic now. They are everywhere.
Have fun East Coasters!!
NEW POST
New Post!
And yes, it's wonky, and I don't know why!
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