Thursday, May 08, 2008

Cabin Fever - Season 4, Episode 11

Locke is enlightened as to the whereabouts of Jacob's cabin, life aboard the freighter becomes perilous, and a 12-year-dead Horace Goodspeed starts talking to Locke...but apparently doesn't make much sense. Enjoy!

398 comments:

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Capcom said...

Are we startin' here yet, or waiting till 10:00?

Capcom said...

BTW, very nice pick for the post image Dennis! :-o

DeDJeZTeR said...

Tick tock tick tock... the gears are starting up and I am getting ready to go. See-ya at 10

maven said...

Have fun guys, will check in later...most likely my first post will be OMG OMG! LOL

Capcom said...

I drank some coffee so I could maybe stay up for your shift Maven! :-D

memphish said...

Yeah I love the last 2 minutes of Grey's Anatomy. It lets me subscribe to the new post.

Melissa_Lossa said...

Happy Lost night! I am SO ready.

Codysmom said...

1...2.....3........go!

Codysmom said...

Locke's mom?

Melissa_Lossa said...

Note to self: don't put cookies in the oven and set the timer to go off at exactly the same time that Lost starts!

acewebguy said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
memphish said...

The Doc's alive!

DeDJeZTeR said...

Damn Three shots and a full clip and none of the clicks fire a shot, the Island really likes Michael.

memphish said...

Yes, that was Emily Locke. Can anyone id the song? And why would Sayid give Keamy names and locations?

Darkaardvark said...

@memphish:

You mean the opening song? Everday by Buddy Holly.

Codysmom said...

I guess the Island's not done with Michael...

LostIt said...

Wasn't Ben's mother's name Emily? Are Locke and Ben half-brothers?

Sayid'sgirl said...

I guess the island still won't let Michael die.

Are they just starting up the missing pieces again? Or have they been doing that for awhile?

Darkaardvark said...

And why would Sayid give Keamy names and locations?

Because the barrel of a gun can be very persuasive?

DeDJeZTeR said...

The song was "Love will come your/my way."

Not sure who sings it off hand, but I knew every word.

Codysmom said...

wow... yes... emily linus

Darkaardvark said...

Was Horace's alternate bloody-nose-trail/non-bloody nose, blood-nose just a makeup mistake or was it something intentional? I couldn't figure out why it switched back and forth.

LostIt said...

Is Horace building "THE cabin"? Is he Jacob? Does the nosebleed indicate that he is/was a time-jumper?

Sayid'sgirl said...

Ahhhh
My husband's boss just called and missed that whole conversation with Horarce.

Sayid'sgirl said...

Richard?!!

Darkaardvark said...

Wait, am I going blind? That looked like Alpert.

LostIt said...

Was it me or did Emily's mother look like she recognized Richard Alpert?

memphish said...

Dr. Eyeliner!

LostIt said...

Sayid's girl, Horace told Locke to find him - that if he (Locke) finds him (Horace), he'll find "him" (Jacob, I think).

memphish said...

Ben and Locke's mothers are both named Emily, but they are not the same Emily. Emily Locke was still alive in a Locke flashback. Emily Linus died the day Ben was born.

Codysmom said...

yay, Alpert's back!!!!!!

memphish said...

Horace was pulling an Eko, marking and chopping down trees. That dream was like Locke's with Eko in ? too.

Melissa_Lossa said...

THAT was weird!

I think Horace was skipping around - that's why his nose was bloody and then not. He knocked that same tree over three or four times.

Sayid'sgirl said...

Thanks lostit.

memphish said...

Horace told Locke Godspeed and his last name is Goodspeed. I loved the ranch dressing shout out too.

LostIt said...

Dark, I'm pretty sure that was intentional. That whole vision looked a bit time-loop-y. It seems like he chopped the same tree down more than once and he definitely introduced himself more than once.

Codysmom said...

So, to me.... shows Jack's "something nice back home" was also a dream?

DeDJeZTeR said...

Sorry got it confused with another song. That is
"Everyday"
by John Denver... died in a plane crash...lol

Sayid'sgirl said...

Jacob's dirt?

Darkaardvark said...

Holy crap was that scene symbolically heavy.

LostIt said...

Morse code on he sat phone - Omar was answering it before?

Melissa_Lossa said...

Secondary protocol had a dharma logo on it - anyone catch which one?

memphish said...

Yeah I saw the outline of the logo. Widmore knows what Ben is going to do before he does it. Time is out of control!

memphish said...

So is a different force leading Locke than the Ben/Alpert faction? And who is Alpert recruiting for in the 60s? For Dharma? For Widmore? Other?

Darkaardvark said...

Nah, Widmore's just a smart guy. But does Ben even know where he's going yet?

LostIt said...

So maybe Widmore was the leader of the others before the purge? Why would he decide to wipe out his own people?

DeDJeZTeR said...

So looks like Sayid is running the boat on the river stix...lol

That first commercial at the break makes me think of the Power Rangers, because the museum that is in the picture on the right is what they used as the power rangers HQ
Don't know why I brought that up as I write it I was like
"Whhy are you talking about this."... lol

memphish said...

It seems to me that the secondary protocol for the Captain out to be to kill Keamy ASAP.

LostIt said...

Did you catch that picture young Locke drew of the smoke monster?

Codysmom said...

geronimo jackson poster inside teenage locke's locker!

DeDJeZTeR said...

Mittelos BioScience reers its ugly head once again.

I didn't see the Don't tell me what I can't do line coming, nope, it came right out of the blue, like a shot in the dark... lol

What were they giving Keemy, was that the quarentine inoculation juice?

LostIt said...

mittlos has been around for a while, huh?

Melissa_Lossa said...

Yeah, lostit - Smokey seemed displeased in little Locke's drawing. :)

memphish said...

I thought they were wiring Keamy with whatever he intends to use to torch the Island or a timer to set the torching.

I'm assuming since Widmore wants the Island though that that idea fails.

Codysmom said...

were they strapping something on Keamy's arm?

Sayid'sgirl said...

This finally must be where Sayid thinks with his heart instead of his gun.
So Locke was a science geek. Richard must think he's ready now.
I'm thinking Richard is the leader Ben was talking about.

memphish said...

This has been an Easter Egg laden episode. I want to see that Book of Laws.

Melissa_Lossa said...

So, Alpert's been watching Locke his whole life. Interesting.


Do we think Widmore used to be the leader, or Richard?

memphish said...

Why would Richard cede leadership to Ben? That's been one of the mysteries for me for over a year now.

And where is Desmond in the future? And I guess we know why only 6 get off. I'm not sure the zodiac will actually hold 6.

Sayid'sgirl said...

I was thinking maybe it was a timer to know what the time difference is on and off island.

Melissa_Lossa said...

And Horace was building Jacob's cabin. It doesn't seem like a building that needed blueprints.

I love Ben's line about Hurley thinking that staying was his idea.

Ellen said...

Did anyone notice the "Book of Laws" Alpert sat out on the table in front of young Locke? Sort of reminds me of the story that Eko told John sitting in the Swan Hatch when he brought the Bible with the edited part of the Swan Orientation Film in it...
xxoo

Codysmom said...

omg... gotta be abbadon

Melissa_Lossa said...

ABBADDON?!

Sayid'sgirl said...

I knew that voice sounded familiar.

LostIt said...

Holy crap! Abadon!

Sayid'sgirl said...

Is Abbadon Jacob?

LostIt said...

So did the island keep Locke alive through that 8-story fall?

Codysmom said...

I hope Frank has a plan

Melissa_Lossa said...

Holy crap!

So, I hope Frank has a REALLY good plan.

Codysmom said...

noticed frank turned on his sat phone... could this help the islanders know what's coming?

Darkaardvark said...

So...objects traveling to the island travel BACK in time, whereas objects traveling from the island pass through time more slowly, whereas the missile... okay, what??

Sayid'sgirl said...

Good question lostit!

Melissa_Lossa said...

Looks like we both have our fingers crossed, codysmom! :)

acewebguy said...

Claire seems as though she has accepted her fate.

That or she is really happy to be with her dad.

DeDJeZTeR said...

Thats why Ben didn't seem to come from the tropics... because the island was not there anymore... oooohhhhhh those pesky PTB

Darkaardvark said...

I know there's a lot to address in those last 10 minutes and the previews always seem a litle better than they usually are... but flashforward to right when they get off the island! Awesome.

Ange said...

Hi everyone. Just a placeholder e-mail comment. Carry on, I need to go move my island :D.

Ellen said...

OMG- they're going to MOVE the island? Hey, hey, I think our group nailed that a while back, huh? Remember the discussion about Alcatraz and how it moves?
xxoo

Darkaardvark said...

Thats why Ben didn't seem to come from the tropics... because the island was not there anymore..

I don't follow you perfectly. Say again?

Melissa_Lossa said...

What, What, WHAT?!


Seriously, What?

memphish said...

Man! Lots of stuff. So where is Jacob? Is there even a Jacob? Or does he change like Locke and Ben changed the guard?

Claire looked a little tipsy, like she did when Ethan had her.

DeDJeZTeR said...

They are going to move the island, so it will not be off the coast of AUS anymore, maybe they go toward antartica.

experimentalfilm! said...

i HAD A FEELING the geography of the island was significant . i had a dream once that the island was eroding .. it made sense lost-wise at the time .

AMAZINGEPISODE next week they come back ? im gonna cry when they do .

and what was that amazing quote that ben said ?
"destiny is a fickle bitch" or something ? hahhahaha

Sayid'sgirl said...

I just realized my recording didn't work. Now I have to wait until tomorrow to watch it again. And I can't watch the promo in slow motion.
And it was a really good episode. Oh well.

Codysmom said...

I get you, ded.... hence the dharka

LostIt said...

Wow! Another great episode! Was that backpack from Frank to help the Losties or from Keamy to trick them?

acewebguy said...

It seems as though attempts have been made for years to get Ben to the Island. Alpert giving him the test as a kid, his teacher/counselor trying to get him to go to the Mittelos Summer Camp in Portland, and then finally Abbadon mentioning the walkabout to Locke.

DeDJeZTeR said...

My guess is that it is from Keemy since Frank clearly wrapped his in something yellow.

Sayid'sgirl said...

Maybe they're going to move the island to the Sunda Trench.

Darkaardvark said...

Maybe they'll pop up right by the antarctic listening station?

DeDJeZTeR said...

Acewebguy,

Bens dad brought him there, Locke on the other hand... lol j/k

memphish said...

I don't understand the sat phone thing at all. Like Keamy wouldn't notice Frank doing that. I really wanted Frank to fly the helicopter into the ocean.

Melissa_Lossa said...

So what does Locke owe Abbaddon now?


And what have Christian and Claire been up to?

acewebguy said...

Sorry not Ben, I meant to say Locke

Melissa_Lossa said...

I didn't get the sat thing either. If Frank tossed it out, what was he trying to accomplish? If it was Keamey, why not just force Frank to land on the beach and waste everyone?

memphish said...

So Abaddon said that Locke is going to owe him one. And Alpert attempted to recruit Locke twice. Does that mean that both sides know that Locke is the key master (sorry for that; I couldn't resist) and each is trying to turn him to their side?

DeDJeZTeR said...

Memphish,

My guess is it exactly what Jack said, they want them to follow them so that they can take them all out at once. My guess is that Frank will take off from them or something and use his to keep tabs on where Keemy and his crew are.

experimentalfilm! said...

i wonder what locke was supposed to say "belonged to him" .. if anything at all . but i dont think alpert and abbadon are on differing sides ...

LostIt said...

I don't quite get Abbadon. He was working to get Locke to the island, but he was responsible for the F4 going to the island. Did he have anything to do with Keamy? Or is he working against Widmore and wanted the F4 to keep the island away from Widmore?

Darkaardvark said...

Why would Abaddon want Locke to get to the island- wouldn't that benefit Alpert/Ben and not Widmore?

memphish said...

I feel like I need Dwight Schrute to make me an organizational chart at this point. Widmore hired Abaddon who hired the Freighter Folk to get Ben who works for/is the boss of Richard Alpert who . . .

And where is Richard and Cindy and the rest of the Others now?

Capcom said...

Wow, I'm stupified.

Claire freaked me out more than Horace!

Li'l Locke was getting a Dalai Lama test?????

I got to see Keamy's giant muscles again, yippee!

Ben has resigned to the changing of the guards fairly well.

They're going to move the island, they're going to move the island! Heehee!

memphish said...

How can Christian Shephard speak for Jacob? And whose side is Jacob on? Great episode for making my head spin after it's all said and done, but it was not my favorite episode. The pacing never got me revved up.

LostIt said...

Yeah, capcom, if Keamy wasn't such an a**hole, he'd be hot!

Sayid'sgirl said...

experimentalfilm
I think he was suppose to chose the book of laws.

Darkaardvark said...

Ben has resigned to the changing of the guards fairly well.

Surprisingly well. I mean, he had the tumor on his spine and knew Locke was healed... for a while now. So why is he talking about it like something's changed now?

Capcom said...

I agree Memphish, it seemed to jump around a lot to me...more so than usual.

LostIt said...

So exactly HOW are they going to move the isalnd?

DeDJeZTeR said...

Dark,

Not if he was a true believer so to speak. Alpert and Ben want John because of what he could do, but if Abbadon and Widmore (if he is working for Widmore) got to him first, maybe they knew his importance and wanted him to take Bens place so that they could take the island.

I think he was supposed to take the ash, the book, and the compass, but when he took the knife they knew that someone else at some other time was trying to get him to take the knife... hence Abbadon saying he should go on the walkabout with just a knife.

Thus proving my above point... lol

If this makes any sense at all.

memphish said...

How is moving the Island with Keamy on it going to help exactly?

But if they do move the Island that explains why the O6 are in one place and Desmond and Michael are in another on the freighter and can slip quietly back into society.

And what prompts Ben to leave and go to October 2005? He just wants to tell Widmore he's going to kill Penny? This does make me think that he leaves the Island in the next week or so Island time and arrives in our world in Oct. 2005 rather than leaving the Island in Oct. 2005 and arriving in the desert in 2005.

Melissa_Lossa said...

Ben seems out of his element at last in this episode. That scene with Hurley sharing his candy bar was great - Ben acted like he'd never had a friend before, and didn't know what to do.

LostIt said...

Dark, I think Alex's death drove it home for him. The island isn't protecting him anymore.

Ellen said...

I think the "look" that Claire and Christian exchanged was one of those "knowing" looks. Like, "We knew he was going to say that! And now we have him right where we want him." I think Claire is either dead or "ascended". Also, I really think the "Temple" will figure in quite heavily in moving the island.
Perhaps it takes a certain type of mind (such as Locke's, or formerly Ben's) to control whatever it is that needs to be controlled in order to accomplish the move.
xxoo

Capcom said...

Interesting about the book, Sayidsgirl.

memphish said...

The whole Dali Lama test (as Capcom put it) brings us back to the whole hunter thing with Locke. Locke wants to be a hunter instead of accepting his destiny. This also shows he's been reading his destiny on the Island wrong this whole time (a pet theory of mine I've discussed on my blog) since he thought it was finally letting him be the hunter. Locke's not supposed to be a hunter, but I'm unclear what exactly he is supposed to be.

LostIt said...

Ded, that does make sense. It's the only way to explain it with our current knowledge, I think. At least, I can't think of anything else that makes sense at this point.

Capcom said...

Ooooooooooh, I like all that you said Ded, taht makes a lot of sense!

Melissa_Lossa said...

So, is the one place that Ben would go the cabin? Or somewhere else?

Capcom said...

Wow, I love the idea that you all have about Locke's destiny being pulled in two directions, by the two (hopefully that's all) factions.

If Richard was trying to get to him before some else (Wid and Ab?) I wonder why he gave up so easily?

memphish said...

I sort of felt like Keamy was saying Ben would leave the Island, so the plan is to kill everyone then go get Ben.

memphish said...

Or it could be The Temple!

Ellen said...

Widmore did say that the island used to belong to him, so perhaps he knows about the location of the temple? Ben does seem to think it's the only safe place on the island, and Widmore seems to know a lot about Ben's activities.
xxoo

memphish said...

Somewhere in the last 2 weeks I heard a theory that Charles Widmore is actually Magnus Hanso. I'd kind of like that. It would explain that line Ellen mentioned about owning the Island.

memphish said...

The Secondary Protocol has an Orchid logo. Or at least the same logo as Ben's Dharka.

Melissa_Lossa said...

Maybe if things went bad, Ben would most likely head for the Orchid to get off the island? So they want to torch it before he has a chance?

Ellen said...

Has anyone seen the dharma logo for the temple? Wasn't it on the map that Ben gave to Alex?
xxoo

Melissa_Lossa said...

I have to say, despite everything that happened, I don't have much to talk about.

I think I'm going to say good night. Good night!

memphish said...

Seems like there was something Ellen, but I can't remember what.

I think the 3rd item Locke was supposed to choose was the comic book. It's about the secrets of a mysterious hidden land.

Capcom said...

I like the idea that Widmore is in the Hanso family somehow, but wasn't he betting on the ledger that was being sold by the family? Or was it already out of the family's hands at the auction? That's the only part that doesn't jive with me about him being related to Magnus in some way.

DeDJeZTeR said...

Yes Ellen, you can find it at lostpedia, under Dharma Symbols, they have it there.

Kind of looks like a solid black circle, similar to the Pearl but black and it is cut off at the bottom and some what shaped like a T

What I want to know about with the symbols is why the Dharka Symbol had the dot and dash marks in a different order and had one of the sections repeat itself?

Ellen said...

Thanks, Ded!
xxoo

Capcom said...

Memphish, when I was watching, I was thinking that he should have taken the comic book, but then I thought that it was a dopey thing to think. :o)

memphish said...

Here's the map with the temple too.

But wasn't it 1996 when Widmore bought the ledger Capcom? I would think the Island was Widmore's before then, but maybe not. Maybe Charles is given to hyperbole. But if not, maybe he was buying the ledger just to keep it out of the hands of others.

memphish said...

So was the cabin moving around in Ep. 4.1 a message to Locke/Ben that they should move the Island? If so, why didn't Ben understand? I guess he was that out of touch with the Island? Or he thinks he's playing by the rules. Does the Book of Laws contain the rules? May I have a copy please Dr. Eyeliner?

Capcom said...

But why would Widmore have to buy it from his own family? I really want him to be related, the more I think about it. Maybe he has to pretend as if he's not (since he's 200 years old?), so then he doesn't have access to family things, and has to buy them in auctions?

Sayid'sgirl said...

Maybe they're not going to physically move the island but move it in time.
And that's why Jack can't find it.

memphish said...

That's my thinking too Capcom. I'd say every 70 years or so he has to reinvent himself.

memphish said...

Sayid's Girl, that makes my head hurt worse! I like physically moving the Island because it would finally explain the Nigerian drug plane. Okay, the vile vortices explains that possibly too, but I like moving the Island better.

Capcom said...

OK, got it now Memphish! :-)

Sayid'sgirl said...

The Temple logo looks like a sunrise over water to me.

Capcom said...

Alright, now I'm thinking in terms of Ben and Widmore as in the Highlander movie, and eventually, there can be only one.

memphish said...

So after tonight I'd say the reason 815 crashed on the Island was solely to bring Locke to it finally after all these years. Alpert tried to bring him as a child, but he wasn't ready and as a teenager. But then it took Abaddon planting the walkabout idea in his balding head. I still can't figure out if Alpert and Abaddon are on the same or opposing sides or in some other configuration. Or maybe Abaddon changed sides after that encounter.

Sayid'sgirl said...

Sorry memphish didn't mean to make your head hurt. :)

memphish said...

Lets get back to Christian Shephard speaking for Jacob. I cannot get my head around this one. For years Ben has allegedly been running the Island at the command of a guy in a cabin named Jacob. Jacob's name is held in great awe, but no one but Ben it seems sees or speaks to Jacob. And clearly there was someone other than Christian Shephard in the cabin back in The Man Behind The Curtain. So has Christian the ghost staged a ghost coup over Jacob the ghost? And why can Locke and Hurley and Jack and Claire see him when only Ben (allegedly) could see Jacob?

And who made Jacob's list that did not include Jack Shephard? Jacob, Christian or Ben? I think Ben.

Capcom said...

But like you all were saying before, if Wid and Abbadon are working against Jacob and Richard, maybe they want Locke to take their "path" to the island. And maybe Locke was destined to be their (as a pawn yet again!) either way, irrespective of who'se side he worked on. I dunno.

But if the two sides were fighting over Locke, he may be the key for whomever gets to finally keep and control it.

Capcom said...

Well, I guess CS has some ties to the island and that's why Jack was supposed to be on the island as well? And Claire?

I really think that Claire acted dead tonight, as much as I don't want her to be a zombie yet.

memphish said...

All right, I guess I'll have to sleep on all this stuff. And we still didn't get an answer to the dead for 12 years, but Alex was 16 question. TPTB have some splainin to do about that one, especially since Danielle and Alex are dead.

Capcom said...

I'm searching on the Book of Laws and coming up with some off-the-wall info....Wiccans, Arabic Baha'i, the Story of the Magic Cloak.......??

Capcom said...

Me too, the coffee's not working. Talk to you tomorrow Maven and West Coasties!! Enjoy!

Sayid'sgirl said...

Danielle wasn't part of the D.I. as for as I know and not part of the purge. (although I always thought she was around when it happened)I guess what I'm trying to say is I don't think the purge and Alex's kidnapping has anything to do with the other. Although I'm not sure how he would explain where he got a baby to the other D.I. members. I was thinking maybe her gave her to Richard at first.
Or it could all have to do with the crazy time on the island.

Amused2bHere said...

Awesome episode...and already there've been some wonderful comments.

I've got to go watch that again.

We still don't know why the doc's cut on his cheek was newer than when he was thrown overboard.

Move the Island? Alcatraz, much?
We called it first!

I love the return of Richard Alpert!!!

Capcom said...

Ruh-roh, we might be back in Oz again, The Great Book of Laws is mentioned in one of the Oz books too.

Dennis said...

Good Episode! See you all in the AM!

Codysmom said...

Aw, everybody's going to bed and I just got back.

The screencaps section at Dark Ufo shows the comic book.. one city floating on top of another.. hmmmm

Codysmom said...

amused, I'm thrilled with Alpert's return, too!

scoutpost said...

Hey all!
Well I can't read the comments yet as you know. I missed the first 15 minutes, so will have to go back and watch afterwards...but I am freaking out about the whole Richard thing!

I'm sure ya'll noticed Locke's Geronimo Jackson poster in his high school locker- too funny.

Sayid just got in the boat to go get the Losties off the island...I'm really tense!

See ya'll after it's over MST.

Codysmom said...

I'll probably be here, but looks like everyone else has hit the sack

Kyle/TheBookPolice said...

Almost a year ago, I posted this entry on my blog.

I feel pretty good about it now.

And yeah, I think Horace is absolutely Jacob.

scoutpost said...

I know it's ridiculous for me to be commenting at all right now, but I have to come on to say oh...My...GOSH! Abaddon! Keamy!
show back on...

scoutpost said...

That was intense- going to catch up on comments.

Codysmom said...

Wow, nice, kyle! I enjoyed reading that... move over J. Wood.. lol

I see you're enjoying the episode, scoutpost:) I know that the hour went fast for me!

experimentalfilm! said...

lostit said...
Dark, I think Alex's death drove it home for him. The island isn't protecting him anymore

agreed . makes sense in terms of "they changed the rules ."

i feel as though christian "jacob" shepard is a negative force . driving claire away from her baby when she's supposed to be raising it .. i believe charlie and the sydney psychic before i believe the "speaker for jacob"

Kyle/TheBookPolice said...

Correction. I did think Horace was Jacob, but I forgot by the time I posted my comment above that the "find me and you'll find him" comment was paid off by Locke finding the map in Horace's corpse's pocket.

So nevermind that part. ; )

Codysmom said...

experimentalfilm! said...
i feel as though christian "jacob" shepard is a negative force . driving claire away from her baby when she's supposed to be raising it .. i believe charlie and the sydney psychic before i believe the "speaker for jacob"

I think so, too. (And watching that scene, it looks like Christian and Claire are sharing a joke.) After all, the last thing we actually heard Jacob say was "help me"... what do you think they did with him? If Locke is falling for this "I can speak for Jacob" stuff, then maybe he'll be saying "I was wrong" like he did after making the Swan Hatch blow up.

Codysmom said...

Sorry, maven... I just have to go to bed. But I'll be back tomorrow... I thought this episode was GREAT! It gave us lots to think about..

scoutpost said...

Wow! There really was a lot in that episode to process. Good point and one that confuses me too is the whole who is Jacob? and like what you just said codysmom, do we trust Christian and Claire considering CS took Claire away from Aaron...and Jacob's only words "help me". It really is confusing to try to figure who's on who's side.

You guys have already started addressing the questions I had. I am really wondering about the Others and the Temple- somewhere, sometime that HAS to come into play.

You know I kept thinking of the movie "Unbreakable" while watching this episode. Like John's teacher told him, he would never be a superhero, Abaddon talked about his falling 8 stories and living, the whole black and white symbolism, guy struggling with his destiny, the comic book on the table....etc. It may not have any real significance with LOST, but I kept thinking about it. Like someone said, there was a lot of symbolism in this episode.

maven said...

This is my OMG marker! WE'VE GOT TO MOVE THE ISLAND!

maven said...

So many questions raised in this episode. You guys seem to be hitting a lot of them on the head!

So Locke has been groomed all along since birth. Creepy with Richard Alpert watching him in the maternity ward. Richard came back to check on him through the years to see if he was ready to fulfill his destiny. Ben really seems resigned to the changing of the guard. Maybe he's even a little relieved...no more responsibility.

Definitely we need some kind of organizational chart to figure out all these strange relationships and who works for who and when! LOL
Who's Abaddon working for? He seems to have a different agenda than Widmore. He's ending John to Australia to start his journey to the island.

I always thought that the 815er's were manipulated somehow to get on that plane and come to the island.

Sorry, I can't quote who ever said it (it's late I'm too tired to look right now), but I love the idea that the island doesn't actually move location, but moves in time! Awesome.

Claire does seem very resigned to her fate/destiny, and seems very relaxed in the cabin. She seems to be in on the whole plan. Doesn't even get upset at the mention of Aaron...my baybee!

Agree that Frank's plan is to get the Losties to follow the signal and overtake Keamy's gang. Keamy seems to know where Ben would be going from the Secondary Protocol (which had the Dharma symbol on it). Which leads me to believe that Widmore knows the history of the island. The possibility that he really is Magnus Hanso would be really great. He bought that ledger in 1996 because it was originally his.

All of these crazy thoughts are just coming off the top of my head and aren't really well-thought out yet...it's late and I'm tired.

maven said...

The visit with Richard Alpert to young Locke (around age 7?) to see if he's special to attend his school: The Book of Laws looks very old. Could it be a history of the island? Was the vial of sand or the ash from the cabin? The screencap of the comic book has a floating city above the same city.

He seemed to be on the right track, picking the right things until he picked the knife (a pretty rusty one). A young boy would think it's cool to take a knife. Did that show that Locke was not ready for his destiny? He seemed to fighting being a science nerd in high school...asserting that he likes cars, etc.

maven said...

In re-reading comments, I see it was Sayid'sgirl who said the thing about moving the island in time.

I feel like I'm talking to myself!

Ange said...

Good Morning!
Okay I had time to read the 70 some odd comments from last night. Not much to add yet today but I thought what Meliossa Lossa said about Ben seeming like he has never had a friend was right on. I felt like it was a Forest Gump moment there with he and Hurley.

Sayid's Girl I loved what you pointed out about the island moving in time and not actually physically. Good thought.

I totally agree that the plane is looking like it was brought there for John Locke but that Aaron, Claire, and Jack have to ne included in the "who the plane needed to bring" list. I'm also sticking to my ideas that Frank was hired to land that plane on the island and because he was traded out last minute something went wrong. That's all for now, and WHEW it's good to have time to actually comment.

Ange said...

and also...
Are we sure that Cooper is actually John's father. I know there was the whole kidney thing, but lots of people are compatible donors.

What with the time jumping coming into play and Richard Alpert being in the hospital, I think it opens up the possibility that Alpert or even C. Shepard could be Locke's dad. Emily Lock's mother did say whoever she was "going out" with was twice her age. Richard Alpert in the flashback would fit that bill.

memphish said...

Alpert could be the father, but why would Emily and her mother both lie about it. I'll have to rewatch to see if I think they knew who he was, but my first impression was that he didn't.

But lets say that Alpert is the father, maybe Locke's got special antibodies that would make his kidney compatible with everyone including Cooper's. (Yes, I've been watching Season 2 of Battlestar Galactica.)

memphish said...

Here's Ryan from The Transmission's take on young Locke picking the knife:

Alpert was upset, saying it meant Locke wasn’t ready. But I for one think it was Alpert that wasn’t ready. I don’t think the knife was the wrong artifact, but a premonition that Alpert didn’t want to see.

Interesting.

memphish said...

Ryan has a great list of questions at the end of his post as well. You can read them here.

memphish said...

Be sure to check out this info Doc Arzt found about the comic book. The story info. is like an outline of LOST.

memphish said...

Upon further review, I think the sat phone was intended to help Jack and crew stay away from Keamy's crew and dumba@@ Jack just misinterpreted it. I'd take Keamy's weapons over those remaining with the 815ers any day.

memphish said...

So if Horace built the cabin, did Jacob pre-exist it? (Horace says Jacob had been waiting for John for a long time; I'd guess since his birth given Alpert's role.) And where did Jacob live before the cabin was built? The caves? The 4-toed statue?

[You know I'll keep posting in a string until 1 of you stops me. :D]

memphish said...

This guy's photo is in Locke's locker along with the Geronimo Jackson.

DeDJeZTeR said...

Memphish,

From what you just posted about the pic in Lockes Locker.

It was in Aden in September of this year that he first met Captain (then Lieutenant) John Hanning Speke who would accompany him on his most famous exploration. Burton undertook the first part of the trip alone.

He made an expedition to Harar (in present day Ethiopia), which no European had entered (indeed there was a prophecy that the city would decline if a Christian was admitted inside)

Maybe John going to the island was what startedthe islands downward spiral into chaos. His faith is stronger then that of the faith of the true inhabitants, and is therefore creating a conflict in sorts.... just thinking outloud.

DeDJeZTeR said...

So first off let me appologize for getting the song wrong twice last night.

This is the real deal.

Everyday" is a song recorded and released as a single by Buddy Holly and the Crickets in early July of 1957.

John Locke was born to Emily Annabeth Locke and Anthony Cooper on May 30, 1956.

SO how was Emily Locke listening to a song that had not been released yet.

Talk amongst yourselves... lol

Kyle/TheBookPolice said...

Thank you, memphish. Everyone on DarkUFO wanted to say it was Christian or some ridiculous garbage.

I agree that the satphone was set to be a bell on the cat's neck, so to speak. That way, the birds will know when it approaches. Didn't they watch that one episode of Scrubs where Turk and JD get Janitor to eat a tracking device?

We have to be precise with our language about the "secondary protocol." I think Keamy knew that there was information related to the secondary protocol in the safe, and that information turned out to be a stolen pamphlet/instruction manual/orientation packet on whichever station has that spirally logo. I think we all agree it's likely the Orchid.

Anyway, the secondary protocol doesn't come from DHARMA; the secondary protocol is an assault on DHARMA.

Sayid'sgirl said...

Seeing Claire in the cabin with Christian makes me think Claire is dead. She says I'm ok I'm with him. And Christian says Aaron is where he's suppose to be. I take that as not being with the dead. Last week someone said Miles had an unusual interest in Claire and thought it was because she was dead. I think I'm going to have to agree with that now.

maven said:
I always thought that the 815er's were manipulated somehow to get on that plane and come to the island.

You're probably right. John did tell Jack early on they were all brought here for a reason and Jack said who brought us here. John tells him the island. I just thought he was over zealous with his beliefs but maybe not.

memphish said...

So here's the thing really making my head spin right now:

Last week Island lets Jack get appendicitis which but for Juliet would kill him on the Island and lead to a Shephard family reunion in the Cabin? Why exclude Aaron then? Is the end game to have all the Shephards die on the Island and live happily ever after (judging from Claire last night) in the little cabin in the woods?

So did Juliet's intervention thwart the Island's plans? If the Island wants Jack dead isn't there easier ways to do that? Has the Island in fact been trying to kill Jack since White Rabbit when he went over the cliff?

And remember those theories that Aaron in fact died in utero during the crash and the Island brought him back to life in Claire's womb when Jin gave her the sea urchin? Is Aaron already dead too?

memphish said...

Bendiana Jones

Capcom said...

Great post-show points everyone!

I for one, had some incredibly FREAKY Lost dreams last night, man!

Has anyone (on this blog or elsewhere) had any thoughts on what was strapped to Keamy's (giant) arm? Could it be some kind of beacon to track, attract, or disseminate Smokey??? He seemed as if he now knew what they were up against after seeing Smokey, and was taking a course of action to deal with it. Or, it could just have been related to the Satphoen beacons, but they seemed rather secretive about it by shutting the door.

memphish said...

Locke had another one of his dreams -- I think this makes 3 (and given the numbers I bet we get at least 1 more before the series ends). Ben says he used to have dreams too. I wonder if Widmore does too, though he thinks of them as nightmares instead.

memphish said...

Capcom, I've seen people say Keamy has a satellite radio on his arm. :D I assume it's some kind of remote trigger. They were packing big canisters I'm assuming of something napalm like and that Keamy will be able to trigger them all remotely. Why that should have prevented Galt from killing him I don't know, but I do know that sailors aren't much with guns, so his reluctance to shoot seemed realistic to me. Foolish, but realistic.

scoutpost said...

Morning LoCo's!
memphish- I like what you posted from Ryan at the transmission about Alpert not liking that Locke picked the knife because it was a premonition that Alpert did not want to see.

After I went back and watched the beginning of the epi a second time, I got a similar feeling- that maybe it wasn't so much a right and wrong thing, as much as it was a sort of fortune/future telling test. Also, if you look at the picture of the Black Smoke that John drew, it is a stick figure man (with no hair- but that may not be significant) who looks like he might be dead- killed by the smoke. I wonder if John foretold his death as a child?
Anyway, back to the test (and John's past), I think it is another example of free will vs. destiny/fate type of symbolism that we've seen. You know, will John pick the items they want him to because he is destined to be some sort of special person and there's nothing he can do about it, or will his will to be a man's man type of guy win out in the end? I think that is why Richard got upset, because he believes in destiny and wanted John to pick some other item so that the future of the island would turn out a certain way. Ok now I think I'm talking in circles so I'll stop.

Kyle- that would make sense about the sat phone- too bad Jack will lead them right to Keamy instead of keeping away from him. Bet Jack will take some flack for that in the end...;P

I don't know if Richard is John's father, but there is some fishy things about that whole scenario. I wonder if TPTB just made a big mistake with the Buddy Holly song? I got the feeling that Emily's mom lied about knowing who Richard was. Although I have no idea why she would know him or under what circumstances. I think there is more there to be told.

I am really puzzled about the Jacob/Christian/Claire/Cabin relationship. I just cannot figure out why CS would be there in place of Jacob, unless like we said last night, that they in opposition to Jacob.

Well I have to go for now, talk to ya'll later!

Sayid'sgirl said...

memphish
I have to disagree with you. My brother was a sailor and he was a marksman. But I have to admit he did hunt before entering the service.

memphish said...

I listened to yesterday's OLP Mother's Day podcast this morning. It is hilarious. There is 1 slight spoiler in that they tell us something we will learn in the finale. It's something they've revealed before. I think all the other forward looking info. was revealed last night.

Kyle/TheBookPolice said...

I'm reading Doc's column now, and his link to the second page reads "The Buddy Holly connection," and it suddenly dawns on me, and I CAN'T believe we either all missed it or didn't feel like bringing it up (I know I missed it).

Buddy Holly died in a plane crash.

memphish said...

Sayid's Girl, my hubby was in the Navy and while he officially had a fire arm he was never given time to train on it nor did he have much access to it. Most ships have Marines that provide the firepower rather than the sailors. I'm sure many sailors can shoot, but I don't think it's their first instinct if they came from the Navy.

memphish said...

Someone mentioned the Buddy Holly plane crash thing last night Kyle.

2costa said...

as you can imagine i have some observations

1. Horace being a dream showed i was right about it not being zombie island quite yet

2. Christain speaking for jacob, reminded me of when ben pretended to be the second bannana when he was in the swan. Also if there is no jacob, then the bearded version locke saw before is maybe a paralell to how zeke had his false beard when he pretended to be the others leader.

3. As i suspected the island is mobile,probably like alcatraz

4. As i had mentioned before i think this is at least the second go round for this scenario, ben's seeming beleif that keamy wouldn't kill alex, and keamy's script that widmore had in the safe seemd to show that both ben and widmore know basically how things played out the first time. My bet is alex didnt get killed the first time around, I have a feeling widmore had something in his script that told keamy kill bens daughter no matter what happens or what he says to you, bens verbal dossier was his on the fly new change tot he scenario, i think its possible that ben didnt use mike as a mole the first time and thats why keamy was surprised he knew all about him. Since keamy seems to know about the weird time thing he is all the more inclined to kill Ben now so ben can go back and have someone hit keamys mother with a car when shes pregnant that type of thing.

5. Im still not sure what side richard is on, bens or widmores. Last season it certainly seems like richard and mikhail were on widmores side. Even though last night made it seem like richard was a good guy for trying to steer locke away from violence. The test richard gave young Locke was very simuliar to the tests bhuddists give to bodi satvas or dalai lamas, they put the chosen kid in front of items that the old chosen one owned and ask them to pick them out, if they pick the right stuff they were right. Heres the thing Ben basically usurped richards power over the others since the purge. Widmore may have even been richards boss at that time. So Richard has bee doing some time travel to groom Bens replacement. Richard wants a weak replacement for ben as the oracle of the idsland. So i think richard trying to make locke a passafist is a score for widmores team, I beleieve that the knife that john chose was the same knife he killed naomi with. Richard didnt want locke to kill naomi because they might have succeeded in extracting Ben that way. Ben has always tried to get locke to be more assertive, ever since the swan, maiking him jealous of jacks primacy. As i implyed before i think that widmore may have tried to kill Lockes mom before she even gave birth, but just like with mike the island wont let that happen, so widmore is left with one option battle for the sould of the living locke. This might be a clue to widmore and ben not being able to kill each other, maybe the island wont let them kill each other even if they try, this is the basis of the game fate vs. free will. Remember Ben told someone they had to choose to be on the side of the others, like jack had to choose to do bens surgery, bens manipulations of jack illusrtate that free will can sometimes be an illusion. Ben didnt technically force jack, but he did...

6. I think widmore bought the black rock ledger for one of two reasons, Not to find the island, to prevent anyone else from finding the island. Also i think its possible that widmore's script of future events may have been encoded in the ledger. as you could see form abbadon and richards meddling with lockes life they were using some kind of precog knowledge to manipulate locke, it would never end as long as ben and widmore both have access to the island, so both ben and widmore are trying to secure the island for themselves to locke down the timeline fromt he other person

7. its clear that both keamy and frank know about the time thing with the island, it goes back to intention, when daniel transported eloise she only knew the maze because he intended to teach it to her, thats why keamy had to kill the doctor in order to keep the timeline intact enough, thats why he said to frank"did i change anything yet" "i dont go thirty seconds..." i think he was gonna say without thinking of every little thing that could mess up time. I have a feelingt that frank knows some stuff from going back and forth to the island so much, i think he may be somewhat unstuck in time, as i said i think this has played out at least once before so frank might remmeber details from that time around

8. I think we will oneday see who taught locke the saying "dont tell me what i cant do" if you think about this keamys remarks to frank and this statement seem to show course correction was a crock. I think Ben had someone teach locke that attitiude, because it would serve him later, dont tell me what i cant do is a straight flipping the bird to fate and that fickle bitch destiny. This goes back to my thoughts that richard is in widmores camp, had locke gone to mittleos science camp he prolly would have gone to the island that much sooner and died in the purge.

9 All these events had me thinking about locke and cooper. First of all cooper had to be working with ben or widmore, becuase hes the only one that could know lockes mom was pregnant. Interesting how they seemed to play the same game with baby locke as aaron. Makes me think that there are twenty year cycles or something, The battle for aaron and walts soul wont be played out til they are grown, by then jack may be crusty enough to look like jacob.

10. I think locke may also be the key to solving the fertility problem, since he was a miricle baby
11. to point 9 i think ben knew locke was to be his replacement but he wanted it to be on his own terms. Richard giving locke the benesque way out of killing cooper, by having sawyer do it seems to go with richard not wanting locke to be aggressive, where as ben wanted him to kill cooper or knew locke didnt have the stones, ben thought that he could avoid the future calamity by getting locke out of the game, i still dont really know where richard fits in on bens team or widmore

12. i think that its interesting that abbadon wanted locke on flight 815, seems to point to widmore in fact being behind the freckage, this also scrammbles my mind to think that maybe ben was the one behind lockes mom getting hit.

more to come later

Sayid'sgirl said...

Perhaps memphish
But then Captain Gault may never have been in the Navy. I don't think you need to have a naval career to run a salvage boat. Do you?

memphish said...

You don't Sayid's Girl. I'm just trying to come up with a reason Galt didn't kill Keamy about a week ago. :D I'm hearing now that the thing on his arm is a deadman's switch. If Keamy dies everyone dies.

But here's an exciting new idea I read in another blog -- what if Abaddon is a grown up Walt?

Kyle/TheBookPolice said...

Oh, you're right. I searched for instances of the word Holly, but it was in a post where ded mistakenly attributed the song to John Denver, another plane crash victim. Mah bad.

2costa said...

if im right that ben wanted to toughen up locke then that would probably mean that cooper was working for ben

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