Thursday, May 24, 2007

THROUGH THE LOOKING GLASS - SEASON 3, EPISODE 22 (POST 2)









The Season Finale hasn't even been over for 12 hours and you've already produced a record number of comments! This post is here to alleviate the lag of loading the comments page. Make sure you read up on the previous post to catch up with everyone's overnight observations, questions, and exclamations.

489 comments:

1 – 200 of 489   Newer›   Newest»
ib4uc said...

Ooooh, first!

Twinkle said...

Hello! Everybody! Love the comments from last night!

ib4uc said...

I have to say, I didn't expect the flash forward. That was too weird.

From previous thread:
DeDJeZTeR said... During my rewatch I caught the name of the funeral home

HOFFS/DRAWLAR

Anagram:

FLASH FORWARD... clue given and recieved...lol


Good catch Ded!

memphish said...

It dawned on me in the night that while people in the flash forward (good anagram catch Dedjezter) kept recognizing Jack as the hero from the bridge, but no one ever mentioned that he was rescued from the plane crash which in retrospect is very, very strange. If Tricia Tanaka were around to do a puff piece she would be sure to include that in the story of the bridge hero.

But it's not like Jack is using a new identity either. The Chief Resident knows who he is, but he doesn't mention the crash or Christian's death either.

It leads me more and more to think that Jack has flashed like Desmond did in Flashes Before Your Eyes and this time, he's not going to leave the Island. He even says to Ben, I'm getting all of THEM off the Island.

I think Adam is Jack. And Jacob is Jack. And Vincent is Jack. (JK about the last one.)

Twinkle said...

Repost of articles from Kristen:

With Dom
With Damon

memphish said...

Thanks Twinkle. I've got a lot of reading to catch up on now that spoilers are off the table for a while.

Twinkle said...

I agree with the person who said that the flash forwards are not all there will be next year. TPTB have promised us more about Libby for one thing. I don't know how I'd feel if the next season started with them all off the island in present day and only flashbacked to the island.

Also are we getting flashfowards of the same story line or our flashforwards like Desmonds? In which case they wouldn't be set in stone.

Twinkle said...

Oh don't be too sure, Memphish. At the end of Damon's article he gives a list of the significant characters who died. One name is prominently missing from the list!

memphish said...

I did dream that Tom came back to life last night and Patchy too I think.

Twinkle said...

The list was did not include any others. Damon listed all the Losties who have died so far, minus one.

Twinkle said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
memphish said...

I looked at that briefly Twinkle and I don't think it was meant to be an exhaustive list, just examples. I assume you're referring to a certain gunshot victim? It didn't list Paolo and Nikki either.

Ange said...

twinkle said...Also are we getting flashfowards of the same story line or our flashforwards like Desmonds? In which case they wouldn't be set in stone.

So maybe the things that were shown to us in the flashforward are not necessarily going to go down the way that we were shown.

Desmond flashes forward all the time and we see it, but we also see it changed. Maybe it will change at some point when we see how the whole thing plays out.

Re Walt: I think that he is running the show from the future. "Don't push the button, the button is bad." Mayde he was talking about the jamming button, NOT the Swan Hatch button.

Walt could be in the future somewhere knowing that they needed to stay on the island so he is manipulating the past by getting all of the right people onto Oceanic Flight 815, getting them on to the island, and then trying to make them do what he thinks is the right thing (not leaving). Jacob=Walt in the way future.

Administrator said...

Totally random thought that may have already been discussed in previous posts: Has it been postulated that Juliet is pregnant? She slept with Goodwin.

Also:
What if Jack's call at the radio tower results in immediate rescue for everyone on the mountain leaving Hurley, Sawyer, Sayid, Jin, Bernard, Desmond, and Juliet on the beach? Would that be enough to continue an island storyline? We would follow everyone else's storyline post-rescue off the island.

When Kate implies that she has to get home to someone, it is her & Sawyer's son.

Ange said...

administrator said...When Kate implies that she has to get home to someone, it is her & Sawyer's son.

admin! I totally agree with this! I was just furiously trying to find what Kate said to Jack about who was waiting for her/who she had to get home to. Anyone got the dialogue?

minnesotawriter said...

Hey everyone...Long time no posty.

I don't think Jack's flashforward is set in stone, simply because, what kind of character arc would that be for Jack? From troubled doctor, to heroic leader on the island, to really troubled doctor. We want to see characters grow and change, but for the better, at least for the core protagonists. So for that reason only (I have faith in the writing staff to tell a great story) I think that Jack's flashforward is merely a possible future scenario. Then again, Charlie couldn't escape his death sentence in the end...But who's to say he couldn't have run like hell to some scuba gear?

At least TPTB gave us quite a bit of material to go over and over and over with until '08. TLE 2, WE NEED YOU!

memphish said...

Admin, We did speculate Juliet might be pregnant from Goodwin and that was part of her desperation to leave the Island. It could still be, but I doubt it.

Kate's Son in the flash forward would be only about 3 years old. I don't think he'll be wondering where she is.

Twinkle said...

Memphish: This is totally a spoiler so I won't talk about it more. Look at the list more closely and remember it's only talking about the 815'ers.

Great idea, Admin! Kate and Sawyer's son!

About future Jack flying free - The golden ticket could be given to the survivors of 815 by the airport (really the airport's insurance company) not the airline if Oceanic went bankrupt.

My favorite lines of the night:
"If you say Live Together, Die Alone, Jack, I will punch you in the face." - Rose

"Want to help me tie him up?" - Rousseau to Alex

I made a rough list of conversation topics from the last thread.

1) Some get rescued.
2) Good-bye, Charlie! *sob*
3) So we'll be getting more/only flash forwards now?
4) Jacob is future Jack?
5) We seem divided on whether Walt was Smokey (or the island) or really Walt.
6) Funeral home Hoffs/Drawler anagrams to Flash Forward! (Thanks, DeD!)
7) The man in the casket: Micheal? Locke? Ben? Somebody else?
8) Ooooooh! A temple!
9) Is Mikhail dead? Why does he keep on reviving?
10) What is future Jack lying about and why does he want to get back to the island?
11) What does Locke need to do for the island? Save Jacob? Prevent the Losties from leaving?

memphish said...

I had an idea that maybe the "He" Kate was referring to at the end was someone involved in the rescue who Kate is with now to protect herself from prosecution. I also noticed that Kate was wearing a blue shirt in that scene that looked like the lady's version of Jack's on-Island tee. Admin, does Mrs. Admin have one of those to go with yours? :D

Administrator said...

Have we gotten a definitive date and/or name from a newspaper screen cap yet?

I haven't been able to find any.

Twinkle said...

Memphish: Tell that to my two year old. She's been hanging around my neck a lot recently! LOL! But still it was late at night and hopefully a kid would be asleep.

Then again, Charlie couldn't escape his death sentence in the end...But who's to say he couldn't have run like hell to some scuba gear?

Dude, none of us can escape our death sentence. The only difference between us and Charlie is that he had warning.

ib4uc said...

twinkle: thanks for the articles. Boo hoo, I will miss Charlie :(

Ange said...

Admin: This is what Dark UFO had just now...

The newspaper that the obituary is removed from has an article on the front cover.

The article reads:
Residents Speak.....
Proposed Coastal...

That is an issue of the La times from April 5th of this year. I do not have the original paper, but here is a link the online version for you to peruse.

Twinkle said...

Thanks! Memphish posted the originals (I think). It's a team effort here!

I guess I have to start my real life now. Check back later!

Administrator said...

Okay. Answering my own question...
Newspaper Clip

I also read that they date on the LA Times was April 5, 2007. Hope that wasn't a mistake. I guess Jack's phone is corroborating evidence.

Ange said...

Sorry, link (from Dark UFO) Here for the LA Times

Twinkle said...

Oh no! Kate is shacked up with Mittlework in a secret underground laboratory while Jack is growing a beard because Hanso's slowly taking over his body! No wonder he wants to go back to the island!

(Really going now...)

memphish said...

Why did Mikhail bother to get a mask?

Administrator said...

From Clipping...
"Man Found...Downtown Loft
The body of J... ...ntham of New York was found shortly after 4 a.m. in the .... of Grand Avenue...."

Does a first name starting with J and a last name ending in ntham ring a bell? Lostpedia?

memphish said...

The scene with Penny reminds me of Basil Exposition in Austin Powers.

memphish said...

I don't know any J...ntham's which might play into my they are using fake identities idea. Last night the characters we could come up with being from New York were Michael, Rose and Bernard.

memphish said...

If Naomi is bad and her people are bad, why didn't she have a weapon with her?

minnesotawriter said...

Twinkle said: Dude, none of us can escape our death sentence. The only difference between us and Charlie is that he had warning.


I guess my point was the unceasing theme of fate and free will in Lost makes me wonder if Charlie died because he let fate kill him or if he had no choice. Desmond chose to interfere with Charlie's fate all season, but he could have let his death occur as he foresaw. The tug-of-war between fate and free will is interesting and well shown in Lost.

Ange said...

memphish said...If Naomi is bad and her people are bad, why didn't she have a weapon with her?

Maybe she did but was unable to grab it when she ejected from the helicopter? Or, maybe it was part of the, I am looking for you, NOT the enemy role she was playing.

Also, I don't think Naomi (or even the people that she works for) thinks they are bad. Good and bad are all a matter of perspective and what side you think you are on.

Dennis said...

Good Morning Locos!

WOW! I can't believe that there are so many comments already. Crazy.

volsnvikes said...

Good Morning Mind Blown Lost Fans!

I haven't read all posts, but I wanted to give my thoughts before I read everyone else’s. Normally I read all of your insights and by the time I catch up I have nothing to add, so I don't post.

Anyway:

1. My wife and I figured out the flash forward from the cell phone Jack kept using around the time he went to the Funeral home. Looked much more modern than 2004 (we were guessing Motto Razor). We then changed our mind when Jack told the Head of Surgery to call his dad down for a game of "Who's more trashed". So Christian is still alive and drinking.

2. Funeral: We think the funeral was for Sawyer. That is the only character that would make since in that setting. That would also lead Jake to think Kate would show up. Although, that might be what they want us to think we think when in actuality they reveal somewhere around Season 5 ep. 12 that it is actually Sun in the box (or something freaky like that). We will see.

3. Charlie’s death: Great writing and acting except for one thing. Why did Charlie not leave the room before shutting the door? Could it not be closed from the outside (wife could not get over this - although she was furious over Charlie's death). Also the wife was yelling at the TV like in a good slasher film "KILL HIM AGAIN, THE ONE EYED RUSIAN AIN'T DEAD YET!"

4. Walt: I think that was an aberration (maybe Smokey maybe something else) I don't think Walt is on the island. To the theory that Locke's memory was of a younger \ shorter Walt my thought is, there would be no way to shoot a younger \ shorter Walt without getting a different actor, and we wouldn't accept that. I think they did the best they could with a young child actor in a growing spurt.

5. Best line of the night (and possibly the season) Hurley on the Walkie, "Attention Others, Come in Others". We re-wound and listened to that about 10 times. I am surprised we didn't wake up the kids on that one.

To finish up, great overall season. It had its slow moments (I think the filler episodes may be over with 3 16 episode seasons), but all in all we learned a lot and the story moved forward. Now I can't believe we have to wait until January for it to pick back up.

ARHGGG.

volsnvikes said...

now to catch up on 500 comments (no work today).

Service Maven said...

The scene with bearded Jack drinking and driving his way home from the airport tipped me off to the flash forward - way to reminiscent of post- island Tom Hanks in Castaway. He's probably not even a doctor anymore, and the hospital docs are humoring him for his mental state. He's MESSED up. Funny - Ben was right: Jack has nothing at home, and everything on the island. It makes me think that the island really is a utopia of sorts that all people wouldn't want to leave once there. I'm excited to see the other losties' fates once off the island.

memphish said...

EW has a Charlie story too. Dom really made the rounds.

If you haven't listened to it, the Dharmalars spent an afternoon with Jorge Garcia last weekend. You can listen to it from their website.

bigdog said...

what are bens true motives. does he want to keep the losties from leaving or someone from coming.

i am still curious as to what is suppose to happen at the temple.

great catch on the funeral home anagram.

charlie was not one of my favorites on the show, but when he wrote on his hand the last message to desmond before giving the crucifiction was just incredible done.

memphish said...

I've changed my avatar to more accurately reflect my mood.

bigdog said...

strange thought, if after they get rescued the island is unable to be seen again.

so whos running the island - richard? does locke stay with rousseau?

memphish - i agree my head still hurts the next day. i do not see myself getting any work done today. kate looked great at the end.

dass99 said...

Did anyone think that maybe the woman who Jack saved was Racheal and her son?
Why did they say Jack was a hero twice over? The car accident and the island ?
Was Kate still on the run? Maybe that's why she doesn't want Jack to contact her anymore and why she wouldn't go to the funeral.

L said...

I have a question....When Jack was stoned in the hospital and he was confronted, he said call my father, get my father down here and see who is more drunk. Was he that stoned or was his father alive?

Twinkle said...

Since his father died because he was a drunk it could have been an ironic statement. Or there's something fishy with the timeline.

scoutpost said...

Morning LoCo's! Lost hangover happening here. Just woke up and I'm precaffeine, but one thing I thought of real quick- forgive me if it's been said- I haven't read comments since last night-

Ok the game changer- we were talking about it being the flash forward- but I'm thinking the game changer actually hinges on Jack doing what he was not supposed to do- make that call from the sat phone. After that whatever events were set in motion somehow changed "history" and that is how Christian Shepherd is still alive, how Jack is an addict and Kate is now a seemingly balanced and settled woman. Gotta go for now- BBL

bigdog said...

IMHO i think jack was just high and a few steps away from santa clara mental hospital.

wouldnt that be something if it ends up that its all in his head. final scene wake up jack time for your meds and all the other losties are in the hospital either as patients or staff.

actually that would stink..

Crossfade said...

Morning all! Just got caught up from last night. About the Jacob=Jack thing, I hope that it's not true. That's just too wierd for me to comprehend and accept. I'm still iffy about Des seeing the future.

memphish said...

Where is Jack's mother in all this? Bring on the mommy issues.

I thought I had written down the names of the mother and son Jack saved, but I can't find it yet.

Twinkle said...

Re: "game changer" - The way I saw this used by TPTB (I forget where) it seemed to indicate a change in the show format rather than a plot point.

maven said...

Morning THE DAY AFTER!
Just woke up from a sleepness night (kept waking up and joting down notes in the dark!LOL) Will catch-up on all your fabulous comments, but just wanted to get some thoughts down in writing:
1. So the first 3 seasons have basically been one gigantic FLASHBACK?
2. Why is there so much guilt from the future Jack? I guess the next 48 episodes will be to find out what went wrong.
3. So Oceanic gave them "Golden Passes" to fly free lifetime? Guess Oceanic didn't go belly up from the crash! And Jack is flying all over the world, hoping to crash again? I think his problem is perpetual JET LAG! LOL
4. Great lines from last night: Rose to Bernard: "If I heop you with the SOS sign, will it change your mind?" Bernard to Rose; "I'm a dentist. I'm not Rambo." Rose (again) to Jack: "If you say "Live together, die alone" again I'll punch you un the face." Hahahaha
5. So TLG is staffed by hostiles loyal to Ben -- not Dharma. But Ben hasn't told anyone else that it's operational and jamming the signals. Communications down because of Ben...not the purpling!
6. So a lot of us got it wrong (including me)...Jack does tell Kate he loves her! But why does he kiss Juliet (yuck)?
7. I don't blame Bernard to telling on the Losties. Remember, he's not Rambo.
8. Ben is getting betrayed on all sides. Mikhael, Alpert, Alex, Karl.
9. Plan is to continue to the TEMPLE. Our new 4-toed statue!
10. Mikhael's sewn up eye (gross)! Why did he have a waterproof patch? LOL.
11. When Sawyer asks Juliet about what work Kate and he had to do: We were building a runway for aliens! LOL Think that was a shoutout to all the fans.
12. Felt so bad for Hurley being rejected because of his size. Felt so great when he came to the rescue! Good for him!
13. Big question about who the obit article was for? Could be Michael, Locke, Ben?
14. OMG...cried during Charlie's big death scene. We'll miss you Charlie Pace.
15. Ben looks at anyone who comes from the outside world as the Bad Guys. Therefore, Naomi is Bad.
16. Reunion scene between Danielle and Alex was kinda weird.
17. Kinda sad to see Tom go. It seemed he was trying to do the right thing.
18. Great technique by Sayid, breaking the guy's neck with his legs!
19. Is there an attack on the island (per Ben) and their way of life? Are bad people trying to kill them all? Or has Ben lost it and is overly paranoid? I guess we are to assume the Ben has been right all along and they are the Good guys. The boat is not Penny's..so who's is it? Are the Hanso people coming back to take over the island after the Purge (which wasn't that long ago).
20. I think Kate ended up with Sawyer after she got pregnant by him. If Sawyer knew she was still seeing Jack, he'd get pissed. That's why the secret meeting at the airport and she was anxious to not be gone too long, (She looked great BTW!)

Okay, that's it for now. I'm sure a lot of my points have been discussed to death already...going to read all the comments now!

Twinkle said...

Doc Jensen has an article too.

TheBookPolice said...

Twinkle - What "Damon article" are you talking about? List of the dead?

Twinkle said...

See the 5th post. Kristen at E had interviews with both Dom and Damon.

TheBookPolice said...

That's what I thought. I didn't see a list. I'll have to reread.

Ange said...

maven said...The boat is not Penny's..so who's is it?

Penny's father's boat? It would explain how Naomi got the picture of Penny and Des, but how Penny dosn't know anything about Naomi.

Crossfade said...

Good to see you mave!

Twinkle said...

Mave said:
So TLG is staffed by hostiles loyal to Ben -- not Dharma. But Ben hasn't told anyone else that it's operational and jamming the signals. Communications down because of Ben...not the purpling!

Wow! I hadn't fully made that connection. Do you suppose? Did Ben keep the women there as a last resort for the fertility experiments? Last night pretty much convinced me that Kelvin was an Other too.

TheBookPolice said...

twinkle - Are you talking about this:

after 72 hours of Lost, we have the idea of communicating to the audience that it's not just the Shannons and Boones and Paulos and Ekos and Ana Lucias who are vulnerable.

I don't think that's meant to be exhaustive. There are at least two names missing from that list. I think it's just conversational.

Unless there's something else there that I'm just not seeing.

Twinkle said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Twinkle said...

I'm deleting my last comment. Who else of the "main" 815ers was left out?

CattyGirl said...

So tired today, but it was worth it.... I couldn't sleep, I was up until 2am. lol

Anyway... I'm still upset about Charlie even though I knew it was going to happen.

maven said...

Hey, Crossfade (and many others joining in last night and today that I haven't seen here for while)...it's great to see you! This finale sure lived up to it's reputation, and will keep us all busy for a while.

There are so many links to articles and recaps and stuff...it's going to take all day to catch up! Thanks to all for posting where everything is!

Ange: The boat could be from Widmore or Paik or Mittelos. Maybe from Hanso since they are probably pissed off about the purge.

TheBookPolice said...

Twinkle - I'm absolutely 100% not seeing it. Post the quote as a comment over on my LOST article (click my name to get there). I'm more curious about where this spoilerish comment IS than I am about what it says.

CattyGirl said...

Twinkle and thebookpolice, are you thinking about Libby?

CattyGirl said...

Hurley must have taken the vw bus to the Dharma (gas) Station. lol Sorry I had to post this bad joke.

ib4uc said...

IMHO, I think Juliet initiated the kiss and Jack was just the happy recipient.

TheBookPolice said...

Libby and Nikki are left off. Also missing is Arzt, but I suspect he's not "main" enough to merit mention.

memphish said...

ib4uc, nice read on the kiss to make it less yucky. Still very yucky. On DarkUFO it's the picture under the newspaper stuff and everytime I scroll down I react violently.

maven said...

So are we to assume that everyone on the island was either rescued or killed? Did Locke stay on the island? He sure sulked off and disappeared at the end.

bigdog said...

if you were rose would you leave the island and die or stay?

we have a good idea of what locke choose.

memphish said...

And would Jack really kill Ben in front of the rescue party? Leave him for Rousseau? My mind is getting pretty gobbledy-gooky.

memphish said...

Doc Jensen's take on Jack and Juliet: All these weeks of Jack cozying up to Juliet may have been a ruse, perhaps an attempt to draw info out of the former Other. Things that make you go Hmmmmmm.

capcom said...

Hi All! How is everyone today? My head hurts.

I woke up with a theory at 4 a.m. about the lying and going back part. What if when they got rescued, they couldn't rescue everyone, and some had to be left behind? Maybe some Losties were stuck in some bad situation (possibly with the Others), and Jack and some of them get rescued, and The World treats Jack like a big hero. But Jack and Kate know that there are still some folks stuck back on the island that need help, so that's why Jack doesn't feel like so much of a hero (cause he didn't save everyone) and that's why he says they need to go back. And the lie is how The World thinks that everyone alive was saved, and they went along with it, but Jack and Kate know that's not true and they know that some people are still stuck on the island and need rescuing.

OK well, like I said, it came to me while I was half asleep, so it's kind of crazy.

Re: Oceanic giving Willy Wonka tickets: was the Hanso Air site real/canon to TLE? Or was it a fan site? Anyway, if some other airlines bought out Oceanic, they could have gotten the freebees from them.

Also, does the funeral guy say that the deceased is male or female? I haven't rewatched the ep yet. I hope that it's not Walt.

Twinkle said...

TBP and Cattygirl: Thanks! So there are several left off. My heart just jumped because I thought I saw something that corresponded to a spoiler I read. NVM. Sorry.

Doc Jensen weighs in on Jack's dad"
I know you're going to talk about it, so my quick take: No, I do not think Jack's references to his father meant that time has been changed and that Christian never died. I chalk it up to plain old drunk-guy/sad-dude crazy talk.

TheBookPolice said...

memphish, administrator - I got a good one for you. It's not a character we've met so far, but given the propensity of TPTB for philosophical naming....

How about "Jeremy Bentham"?

Twinkle said...

Capcom: I think you're on to something. Something went wrong with the rescue.

Ange said...

bigdog said...if you were rose would you leave the island and die or stay?

People I think Stayed:
Locke
Ben
Danielle

I don't know if Rose stays or not. I think that maybe it is possible, I mean you are right, why would she want to go back and get cancer? But why stay and have to live like a jungle person and deal with whatever else is going on?

capcom said...

Codysmom, my littlest nephew is making me keep the fainting Hurley up on the screen so he can watch it over and over. :o) Thanks for the laughs!

memphish said...

TBP, I think you need to start a Lost Community Philosophers Club for the hiatus. Be sure and update us when you update your blog.

memphish said...

Here's another one for you TBP

Minkowski told him that rescue was on the way. (''Minkowski,'' no doubt, is a nod to Hermann Minkowski's theory of four-dimensional space-time, which has inspired many Lost theories.)

TheBookPolice said...

I read that in Doc's column! I read J. Wood's guest commentary and heard the name during the broadcast. My brain was racing to make the connection, but didn't until Doc revisited it today.

You just have to know that any name casually mentioned will have some deeper meaning.

Mary said...

I'm not writing Charlie off as dead yet -- he can still swim through that open porthole. He wasn't yet unconscious when we last saw him. Desmond could even swim around and pull him through the porthole, maybe.

I think Jack's flash-forward is a red herring, and I'm not basing any theories on it, because in it, his dad is apparently alive again? I don't think that future is set in stone for him. It just made for an interesting season-finale storyline.

Sayid is Rambo (!), the way he snapped that guy's neck with his legs! And Hurley saves the day! My money is on him (no pun intended) to finally get them on off the island somehow, three years from now.

But not before they explain to us what the numbers and the polar bears and the smoke monsters mean.

bigdog said...

what are we suppose to do with ourselves for 9 months.....

ange - you think karl and alex stay? i wonder have they ever been of the island on assaignment?

capcom said...

Is it just me or does that casket look smallish in the screencaps on DarkUFO? Could it be Walt in there? Jack did not really get to know Walt intimately at all, and he was of course, not family. Just about everyone else, Jack would have come to know by the rescue. But, I cannot guesstimate the reason for Kate's apparent disdain or surprise at the mention of going to the viewing.

Twinkle said...

I was just thinking: It's over. There is no chance than any new information will come out at this point (although Doc Jensen is advertising some juicy tidbits on Friday). There's not even going to be a glyph from Rachel. *sigh* Guess I can get offline now and pay attention to my children. ;-)

maven said...

ledgeweb's site has a screencap of Ben's diary with some words highlighted that are readable. Can anyone make out anything else?

capcom said...

Well,now that I think about it, it doesn't make sense that Walt would be the one who allegedly killed himself. I wonder if it will turn out that the suicidee had survivor-of-the-left-behind-guilt also, like Jack?

TheBookPolice said...

twinkle - Yeah, "radio silence" is kind of a bummer. But buck up! There's the Book Club, and I may take memphish up on the Philosophy Club idea...

There will be LOST activities to take a little bit of the edge off the withdrawal. Like LOST methadone. LOSTadone.

scoutpost said...

Well I haven't caught up yet- just jumping in from where I left off-

capcom said...What if when they got rescued, they couldn't rescue everyone, and some had to be left behind? Maybe some Losties were stuck in some bad situation (possibly with the Others), and Jack and some of them get rescued, and The World treats Jack like a big hero. But Jack and Kate know that there are still some folks stuck back on the island that need help, so that's why Jack doesn't feel like so much of a hero (cause he didn't save everyone) and that's why he says they need to go back. And the lie is how The World thinks that everyone alive was saved, and they went along with it, but Jack and Kate know that's not true and they know that some people are still stuck on the island and need rescuing.

This is what I thought. The only thing I don't like about this scenario is that it is too much like the show The Nine that ABC cancelled- for good reason- it was stupid. The whole premise being "what happened to these people during a hostage situation?" There was even a guy who took a heroic status who wasn't really a hero.... Anyway, I hope LOST doesn't take the same route and that there is more to the story than that.

luckyguylikeme said...

I'm not caught up on comments, so I'm sorry if someone was already talking about this.

My idea for the next 3 seasons is that we will get many flash-forwards, but the "present" story will still be on-island. The last episode of the series will be them getting rescued. This way, we get both stories at once; we learn what happened up to their departure (the on island storyline), and what happened once they got back home. In that format, they can create hundreds of mysteries. While in the flash-forwards, we can see how changed they are, and by watching the on-island story we will see what caused it.

capcom said...

There's something possibly going on with the "Je____ ____ntham" in the obit. DarkUFO's got the link to the wiki article on Jeremy Bentham, and he was involved with social reform such as slavery, human rights, etc. Interesting.

memphish said...

I think we can trust TPTB to even get The Nine right. After all we have 3 years, not 2 hours invested in these characters. There are thousands of Fan Fics out there already speculating on what happens to these characters if they do get rescued. Now we get to see the creators' take on it.

While I like the idea that something went wrong during the rescue, I don't think people are still stuck on the Island who wanted to leave. I don't think Kate who as Sawyer pointed out last night is always going back for someone would be that indifferent to that idea.

capcom said...

Yeah Twinkle, the philosophy slant would be great!

Hmm, I never did remember to watch The Nine, Scoutpost. Looks like I didn't miss much. :-)

memphish said...

So Jeremy Bentham and Magnus Hanso would have stood on opposite sides of the slavery debate? Is Alvar more Bentham's heir than Magnus'?

Ben tells Alex he CAN'T just let them leave. It's pretty clear people can't get back to the Island, maybe that part of the Purpling story is accurate at least. Why can't Ben let people leave? Was Locke right all along that "each one of us was brought here for a reason" by the Island itself?

capcom said...

But didn't Jack reiterate that he wanted to get "all of them" rescued? It seems to be all or nothing with Jack, I can see him not being a happy hero (but could he ever be?) unless he got everyone off the island. I have to watch that again.

TheBookPolice said...

capcom - Where's the Bentham link on DarkUFO? And did they add it before or after I mentioned Bentham at my 10:28 am CDT (8:28 PDT) post?? Thieveses!

capcom said...

Good points Memphis, maybe Ben is protecting the island from more DIs and Hanso peeps coming back? He might not know that the DI is supposedly defunked. His saying that the supposed rescuers were the bad guys, makes me think this. I really wished that we could have gotten a bit more info about who the Hostiles were before the break, that would help.

capcom said...

I think it was in the blogging section of the funeral parlor, in the screencaps.

Twinkle said...

TBP: Or talk to Admin about using Stories Of The Lost for the philosoper purpose. That'd be cool to have a post on each philosopher and discuss it's relevance to us and to Lost. Maybe he could make you a contributor if you're interested?

What do you think, Admin?

scoutpost said...

TBP- I saw the Bentham stuff on Sledgeweb last night.
But I'm still VERY impressed that you came up with it all by your lonesome!

Twinkle said...

Check out Jorge on Kimmel (posted on DarkUFO). Jorge is Mario from Beauty and the Geek's twin!

;-)

TheBookPolice said...

D'oh! He beat me by hours!

maven said...

Now we have Jeremy Bentham to speculate on all summer besides Jacob!

scoutpost said...

Trying to catch up and keep up at the same time- talk about confused... Just watched the Kristin interview with Dominic-

I'm so sad :( (As sad as when Mark Greene died on ER, and when Henry Blake died in the plane crash on MASH)

TheBookPolice said...

I don't know if I'd want to intrude on the SotL page. It seems to have its own purpose. But I'm open to ideas.

Anyway, gotta hit the road. This is my dogeared page.

Twinkle said...

Hafta say that the way they shot Walt from Locke's perspective looking up from the pit was as good as they could get to disguise the actor's height growth. Kudos.

Ange said...

bigdog said...ange - you think karl and alex stay? i wonder have they ever been of the island on assaignment?

HOLY SMOKES...I totally wrote that I think Karl and Alex stay, but deleted in when I previewed the comment because I am not sure yet why I think that. Are you in my head!?

I am not sure if Alex has ever been off of the island before, but my gut says no. I think Karl maybe as he seems versed in x-rays, and maybe picked up that skill in the outside world.

Twinkle said...

The philospher thing is totally up SotL's path, if I understand correctly. Admin and you can decide but I'd vote for it!

Codysmom said...

wow, finally caught up on the posts...

service maven said... (about future Jack)
He's probably not even a doctor anymore, and the hospital docs are humoring him for his mental state. He's MESSED up.

I think you've got that right...


bigdog said...

what are bens true motives. does he want to keep the losties from leaving or someone from coming.

I think it's both. I have a thought that the hostiles really are the good guys and they're in charge of keeping the universe on track, or else........ well, the or else is what will keep this show going for 3 more years.


capcom, guess I can't change my avi, then:)

Young Wallace said...

Anybody found any new glyphs? I'm bored already waiting for February...*sigh*

Codysmom said...

Twinkle said...
Re: "game changer" - The way I saw this used by TPTB (I forget where) it seemed to indicate a change in the show format rather than a plot point.

according to the Sorry Charlie EW article Carlton Cuse says:

What are the chances that he'll return in one form or another?
CC: The irony of Lost is that a lot of characters work a lot more once they're dead. Charlie could exist in someone else's flashbacks. Look, the island is capable of conjuring up things from people's pasts. It is entirely possible that Charlie will appear in the show again. We've actually talked a lot about it, but to say more about that right now might blow the element of surprise

They're still talking about using flashbacks, so I'm not so sure the format will now be flash-forwards.

James said...

Jeremy Bentham also invented the Panopticon, which is what the island basically is, a prison wherein you discipline yourself because you never know when the guards are watching.

Codysmom said...

Does anybody else think that Jack's flash-forward could be TPTB telling us to quit obsessing and get a life or we'll end up like him:)

Codysmom said...

Of course, that's not going to stop me!!!

Young Wallace said...

if we don't obsess, then LOST isn't on the air. they NEED us!

Codysmom said...

I'm thinking the cliff-hanger this season is actually.... does Desmond make it back to the beach, get the walkie from Hurley, then warn Jack & Co. that the "rescue" boat is not what they think? Then, hopefully, Ben will have to tell them SOMETHING about why he's been preventing them from leaving. Maybe Ben has learned that lies aren't necessarily the way to go....

ib4uc said...

young wallace... dat you? Long time, no see.

It's good to see some old TLE bloggers popping up.

Codysmom said...

true, young wallace! In that case, how about a little TLE2?????

scoutpost said...

Obsessing? Who's obsessing? I've got so many tabs and windows open on my computer right now, it's ridiculous! LOL

Codysmom said...

me, too, scoutpost:) And I'm kicking myself for making a hair appointment today (of all days!), so I'm going to have to scoot soon...

bigdog said...

ange - great minds:) i think if they have never left they would stay. if they have seen the other side they would leave.

codysmom - just noticed your avitar. thats funny. i really think that ben was telling the truth about naomi. the whole survivors are dead didnt come up with the guy who answered the phone.

And wouldnt desmond have heard on the radio in TLG hurleys message to the others?

maven said...

The point that has been bothering me is: Future Jack tells Future Kate that they have to go back. Now does that mean they need to get back to the island (and that's why he has all of those maps and he's been traveling in that part of the world hoping to crash back on the island)? They need to physically get back on the island to make things right, to fix things in the time frame he currently is in. But does it also mean that they need to get to the island in the past to correct things, and if so, how does he do that? Is there a time portal in TLG?

bigdog said...

by the way. i have to be an idiot. i never realized what the preview option was. i could have saved myself so many spelling errors..

Codysmom said...

memphish said...
Ben tells Alex he CAN'T just let them leave.

I noticed that, too. And in TMBTC (I think) Ben says something to the effect that it came to the point (during hostiles vs. dharma) that one of them HAD TO GO... I'll have to go back and make sure I've got that right, but essentially, it's SO DEFINITE making it seem so important, not just a revenge killing.. It's something bigger than we realize that's motivating Ben?

Sayid'sgirl said...

Morning LoCos well I guess it's afternoon now. :)
I've spent all morning trying to re-watch the episode and catch up on the posts not anywhere close to that.
Was just wondering if anyone else heard the whispers right before Walt shows up and stops Locke from shooting himself?

Melissa said...

Not sure if anyone has mentioned this but my husband and I figure that Jacob is manifesting himself into the visions people see on the island. Lock seeing Walt lastnight was really Jacob. Eko seeing his brother. Jack's sighting of his father. The horse Kate saw etc. Perhaps Jacob is curious about them and is showing himself in this way.

Young Wallace said...

It is I in the flesh, ready for Most-Unproductive-Summer-At-Work II. But since they're not have any sort of online game, I guess we're all stuck for 9 months wondering if Desmond gets out of the looking glass and warns Jack, if Mikhail survived AGAIN(!), if Ben is a liar AGAIN, who was in the casket, and why Jack wants so badly to return. Unfortunately, we've gone all around those circles in just under 14 hours (since the episode ended). Hey, here's a cliffhanger for ya: Who's gonna dig up the diamonds buried with Paulo? now THERE's a 9 month conversation waiting to happen...

scoutpost said...

Sayid's girl- Yes I did hear the whispers- forgot all about it though- so I haven't researched anything on them. Have you?

Maven- Good questions! I think you have hit the nail on the head- what does that mean timewise?

Codysmom said...

sayid'sgirl, I heard the whispers. Hey, your boy really impressed me last night, getting rid of one of Ben's men with just his feet:)

Codysmom said...

I'm confused about why Ben lets some people go to the outside world and not others.....

scoutpost said...

Hey Young Wallace!
And to add to the 9 month torture- according to DL and CC- they are going into strict "radio silence" on Season 4 because of the spoilers that got out recently. So they won't even be giving us anything juicy to chew on! Major withdrawl!

Twinkle said...

This is for you, Young Wallace, Cody's Mom, and TLC:

54, 68, 65, 20, 6D, 75, 73, 69, 63, 20, 65, 6E, 64, 65, 64, 2F, 54, 68, 65, 20, 62, 61, 62, 79, 20, 63, 72, 69, 65, 73, 20, 6C, 69, 6B, 65, 20, 68, 65, 20, 6B, 6E, 6F, 77, 73, 2F, 43, 68, 61, 72, 6C, 69, 65, 27, 73, 20, 47, 72, 65, 61, 74, 65, 73, 74, 20, 48, 69, 74, 73

ib4uc said...

young wallace... stay occupied and in touch with TLC -- join the book club. There is a list of books by month on the front page, I think.

Sayid'sgirl said...

scoutpost said:
Sayid's girl- Yes I did hear the whispers- forgot all about it though- so I haven't researched anything on them. Have you?

No I haven't had the chance still trying to catch up on all these posts.

codysmom said:
sayid'sgirl, I heard the whispers. Hey, your boy really impressed me last night, getting rid of one of Ben's men with just his feet:)

Yeah how cool was that. I was yelling shoot him! shoot him! when he had a bead on that guys head that had Jin. Does that sound to awful of me?

Twinkle said...

Are they just doing posts about the books and then commenting about them? My book reading slate this summer is full but I'd enjoy reading everyone's comments. And I've read a few of those books before anyway.

capcom said...

Good Q Maven on whether or not Jack means back to the island, or back in time. That was kind of tickling my brain too, but I didn't wanna think it meant back in time. If it does, that means the TPTB have a definite apparatus for travel to appear in the upcomming seasons!

capcom said...

Wow, Lostpedia is so dead still.

Codysmom said...

Thanks,twinkle... that was fun!

Yeah, sayid'sgirl.... you're a bad person and will never get on Jacob's list:)

capcom said...

If Jack is now (according to the newspaper) basically living in realtime, can we apply TLE incidents to the story now??? Huh-huh-can-weee???? I want to! :o)

Well, at least now when weird DI-type things happen in the flashforwards, we don't have to say that it is before TLE time so it couldn't have happened yet!

Codysmom said...

Good point, capcom!! I think we can.

Regretfully, I have to go.. bbl!

maven said...

Capcom: That would be great if some of TLE is easter-egged into present day flash/forwards. It would be a great shoutout to us!

Codysmom said...

ok, one more thing before I go....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Jbentham.600px.jpg

maven said...

Doesn't look like anyone WE know! LOL

Sayid'sgirl said...

codysmom
That's ok I'm not sure I want to be on Ben's list. Also I think Ben lets people he thinks are committed to the island come and go because he does't think they will betray him or the island.

ib4uc said...

OK, I'm confused. Bentham looks like Jacob. But, where did his name come from? TBP mentioned it earlier as maybe that was the name in the newpaper article.

Sayid'sgirl said...

capcom & maven
Yeah I was wondering if back was back to the island or back in time.
I think it's both back in time to the island. I don't think they would bring in the whole time travel thing in if they weren't going to use it in some way.

Way up there somewhere dass99 was wondering if hero twice over meant the car crash and the island. That's what I thought at first then I figured he meant saving two people the mother and her son.

Amused2bHere said...

Ah, a lull in the action. I guess we're all listening to those podcasts we stayed away from (no spoilers for us!) and reading the articles and blogs we had avoided.

Or getting our hair done.

I think I'll take the car for an oil change.

Nah, there's a podcast calling my name...!

DeDJeZTeR said...

So um yeah,

Three new names to tool around with. Jeremy Bantham, Pascal, and Minkowski....
Brain reaching overload.

Cpcom,
No mention of gender of any kind at the Funeral home.... remember Funeral is an anagram for
Real Fun.... lol

Ange,
There is no need for stayers to live like jungle people. The others are nearly extinct and there is a motel 6 just sitting there waiting, and t protects against smokey, why would they continue to live in the jungle.

sean said...

I can't stay long, but I have a thought about how the show ties into TLE:

remember in TLE when Mittelwerk was trying to transport a virus in a giant freighter? well, maybe it's mittelwerk on the freighter. He came to administer the virus to the "others." I'm getting the impression that Mittelwerk doesn't know that flight 815 crashed on his island, but he does somehow know about Ben's rebellion. Maybe he was doing this as some sort of revenge. Ben did say that whoever is on Naomi's boat wants to kille verything on the island.

I know there is a hole. The show takes place in late 2004/early 2005, and TLE took place in 2006. But this could somehow be the big plot twist that brings Hanso into the show. It just seems wierd that they would have so many freighters running around.

Or I could be completely wrong.

Ange said...

Ded: I am not saying they would live exactly like they were in the jungle, but it seems that without some kind of intervention they are going to have to figure out how to fend for themselves and/or take over any sort of farming or food production that is on the island. Also, hamster wheel or not, where is the power coming from? With people being whisked away will there be power? I was just thinking that yes, they can move into Motel 6 (we'll leave the light on for you :D), but it will be more like camping than the civilization of the real world.

memphish said...

Ooh Sean, that gave me another idea. We agreed last summer that the Island Mittlewerk was going to wasn't "real" didn't we? That's because it's the LOST Island. Still timeline problems between 2004 and 2006.

memphish said...

Yes Ange and Ded, with no Brady Bunch what kind of world can it truly be? :D

sean said...

i know. the timeline thing is really frustrating. if it wasnt for that, it would make a lot of sense.

capcom said...

That's who Jeremy Bentham is!!!! I saw that creepy body of his on something like Ripley's a couple years ago. Whew, that's the weirdest sign/hint we've gotten yet from TPTB!

Oh wow Sean, that's right, that Spider Protocal freighter for shipping viruses and dead infectees! Oh oboy, here we go TLE plot! Next winter, that is.

Sayid'sgirl said...

I've been thinking about TPTB killing off Charlie thus killing the his little nuclear family. But if you remember Claire was told she was suppose to raise her child alone.

whitefalcon said...

hey so any word on a new ARG?

whitefalcon said...

its been since last summer that ive been on here but now that we're in off-season mode it sure would be fun to have a good arg going - it was fun last summer even though i didnt particularly care for the ending

whitefalcon said...

btw i saw that jeremy bentham thing last night - there sure are a lot of philosopher references in this show - looks like one of the writers must have been a philosophy major and finally has found something practical to do with his degree

capcom said...

I wonder if in the future/present, Jack will now become a munchausens-by-proxy person, cuasing accidents so he can have something to fix and be the hero. :o)

memphish said...

Capcom, I thought the same thing about Jack as well. I even wondered if he was the cause of the plane crash for that reason, but dismissed that idea as too crazy, even for me.

Whitefalcon, I like your philosopher theory. I hope that by Comic-Con TPTB will come up with something to keep us going. Heroes is doing tons of stuff what with the on-line comic and all. Meanwhile, last time I checked ABC's LOST site they were still missing an episode from this season in the promotion photos.

DeDJeZTeR said...

I really don't agree with the theory of a possible future, or that Jacob=Jack(future). I am almost certain the only playing with time we ever saw or will see is with Desmond, which like some have speculated, is done. Desmond saw Charlie's death's and since Charlie made peace with the situation Desmonds flashes are gone.
"No, nuthin Brotha."
There is no need for course correctin since this is the right course for time to be on now.
I don't think Jack want's to get back to the past, just to the Island again. He has an addictive personality type as did his father and off the Island there is to much around him to deny it. On the Island he only had what was available to him.
He wants to go back because he not only hates his knew life, but thinks of the time on the island as his Greatest hit #1

whitefalcon said...

reminds me of an old joke:

what do you call a philosophy major with an answering machine?

an optimist

memphish said...

Ded, if Jack's on-Island life of losing patients (except the Bug-Eyed guy), stunted romance, running from Smokey, pushing buttons, chopping wood, etc. is the best this guy had, he should have jumped. I'm having a hard time understanding such a maladjusted person.

scoutpost said...

capcom said...I wonder if in the future/present, Jack will now become a munchausens-by-proxy person, cuasing accidents so he can have something to fix and be the hero. :o)

Now that would be really sick. (But very interesting) And poor memphish would hate Jack forever if that was the truth. :)

whitefalcon said...

the idea that makes the most sense to me, given what we saw last night, is that Future Jack wants back to the island because, in the future, bad things have happenned to the survivors who were rescued - J....ntham suicide, the coffin he visited (not neccesarily the same person i think), etc etc - and that J...ntham, whoever that is - be it Locke or Ben or Jacob or someone else , whoever - held the secret of how to get back. his despair may be coming from his realization that, like everything else in his life that he's tried to fix, his efforts in the long run only made everything worse - and now its too late. eg - he loves kate but shes with someone else (way too early to tell who)

i am curious as to whether his dad is alive though ...

this show defines the word cryptic

but i have to say the finale was the best episode yet. war hurley! hugo = my hero!

scoutpost said...

Yeah memphish- after seeing how tortured and messed up Jack was last night, I began to think he should've jumped when he had the chance. :P

scoutpost said...

Hey whitefalcon! How the heck are ya?

You know Jack obviously wasn't with Kate in the future/present, but he also doesn't appear to be with Juliet either. And of course we know what happened to Sarah. Jack is not lucky in love.

memphish said...

I'm stealing this from Jonah on another board. It is well-reasoned and insightful as to who is in the casket:

Ben is the one in the casket for 3 reasons...

1) As soo as Jack finds out he goes to try and kill himself. This is because Ben is the only one with enough info to get back to the island.

2) Jack tells the man at the funeral that he neither a friend nor family of the deceased.

3) Kate looks disgusted when Jack asks why she didnt go to the funeral.

4) No friends or family showed up either.

5) The popular theory about the name on the news clipping is that it says Jeremy Bentham a name Ben would very possibly like to assume upon returning to the states. Bentham was a child prodigy who grew up to be an early advocate of utilitarianism. Influences of Jeremy Bentham include John Locke and David Hume. Jeremy Bentham also was the inventor of the Panopticon - a prison that would allow an observer to observe all prisoners without the prisoners being able to tell if they are being observed or not, thus conveying a "sentiment of an invisible omniscience." This ties in to several elements of his role on the island as well as his desire to allow his people to think they could leave at any time, not knowing they were his prisoners.

xo
Jonah

Crossfade said...

Maybe Jntham blew himself up or killed himself is such a way that there wasn't enough of the body left to put into a coffin. So, his insurance company bought him a miniature one.

scoutpost said...

codysmom- re: that wiki entry on Jeremy Bentham...granted we could draw a Jacob parallel, but was anyone else disturbed by that?! That is his actual skeleton on display (with wax head because students used to steal the real decomposing one)! Those crazy English!

andrea said...

Hi to all...I'm a newbie, living in Canada. Judging from the comments, the episodes we get here leave a bit of the content out that you guys get (figures).
Can anyone suggest which sites would be good for me to go and catch up on all this amazing info everyone has put together?
I've checked out a few but didn't keep the addresses (stupid me).

whitefalcon said...

hiya scout!
yes im back again ... tried to stay away but after last night i know i will be jonesing for a lost fix

scoutpost said...

Hey andrea!

You can watch the episodes we see on www.abc.go.com

But LostPedia is a good resource (www.lostpedia.com) but it is down right now.

Memphish- that post by Jonah was well thought out and could be possible as Ben has been known to use aliases. When are we going to find out who Henry Gale really was?

maven said...

Hey, Andrea! Welcome to TLC (or as we refer to ourselves LoCos!)

Personally, I visit the following for screencaps, recaps, news, etc:
DarkUfo , and TheTailsection

memphish said...

Good question Scoutpost. Who was Henry Gale? And since Chucklez isn't here I'll also add 4-toed statute?!?

Welcome Andrea. Most places are probably going to be swamped today. Lostpedia is awesome. I also like Lost Hatch and we all love Dark UFO.

maven said...

Lostpedia is down again.

bigdog said...

would mikhael go back and tell richard what he knows about ben and TLG girls or is he a loyal soldier that has nine lives.

also it takes 3 years to finish the show. so did we just see the end of the show and know we are going to work backward from there?

ib4uc said...

Don't forget Sledgeweb (it's down also -- must be the case of too many people trying to access and overloading it.)

DeDJeZTeR said...

My guess as I have said is that Hanso is on the freighter. Henry Gale was the original Naomi. Back when the purge took place they sent in a Balloon because they thought the low tech would just sail on in.... it didn't. It was a Widmore Balloon, readily available to The Hanso Foundation, since they are partners in this venture.

Another off the wall idea is that Naomi is from Paik. Through different talks Paik finds out that 815 has survivors and his daughter is one of them. He is now on a mission to find her.
This is the least possible scenario so far, but I just wanted to put it out there.

Memphish,
That is kind of why I find that bit with Jack so compelling. His and maybe others that he saved have had such horrible lives since the rescue, that he would give anything to get back to the island where while things were srange, they were all relatively happy. They had friends, almost Family if you will and life was good, compared to the horror that is Off-island.

memphish said...

Right Ded, but seek help Jack. Please! :)

I was thinking, was the flash forward 2010? Does Jack actually have an old cell phone like I do instead of the cutting edge? Those cars were relatively old judging by their license plates. I'm pretty sure California has been on starting number 5 for a while now. Is that correct Maven?

acewebguy said...

Sorry if anyone already said this.

I that the "flash forwards" may be Jack's imagination. Maybe Locke really did shoot Jack, and this is Jack hallucinating about being rescued?

Next season will start off with everyone rushing to Jack who is on the ground bleeding.

experimentalfilm! said...

whoever said that it was ben in the coffin cause jack was upset that hed had so much information on how to get back to the island and is now dead - awesome theory !!

Kim said...

http://www.latimes.com/la-spinoff-lost24may24,0,3112143.story?track=mostviewed-storylevel

The LA Times has a sense of humor...

memphish said...

Acewebguy, An Occurrence at Owl Creek Bridge?

Do we know when Henry Gale arrived on the Island? Was it after Desmond? Was Henry Gale the first Naomi sent by Charles Widmore to find Desmond? Is someone tapping Penny's phone line? Searching her desk? And how did they get that photo from her bedside table? It must be the picture taker!

acewebguy said...

Also, I was thinking about Danielle. I think it was said that she left the message and killed her team b4 she gave birth. Maybe she used some of that Dharma poison - given to her by Ben.

Whereas Ben was content with getting rid of his people, it drove Danielle sort of mad. When she gave birth, she may have felt that she was a unfit mother because of what she did and gave up her child. And who happened to come along??? Benjamin Linus.

Twinkle said...

I was thinking Danielle killed her team, not because they were sick - we found out the quarantine was bogus - but because being pregnant, although it didn't kill her, drove her loco.

Administrator said...

People keep talking about how Jack wants to get back to the island b/c it was a "happier place" for him or he found some meaning there that he didn't find in the real world. I really don't think it was implied that his desire is to return and make a life on the island. It seemed clear to me that Jack and Kate left some (or one) of their friends on the island and Jack simply felt GUILTY about leaving them. He has a psychological compulsion to go back and get them but he is going crazy b/c he can't. I don't think he has a psychological compulsion to go back to the island and stay there...just to retrieve/save those that were left behind.

bigdog said...

when they were coming for the woman i noticed that the girl with them didnt have a gun but she had the injection gun. was that the same thing they injected claire with?

Twinkle said...

Hey, Admin! I agree. I don't think Jack wants a life on the island. There's something there he feels he needs to set right.

bigdog said...

maybe they left juliet behind

memphish said...

Bigdog, don't even go there. Can you really see Island Jack leaving people? I can't see that. I could on the other hand see Naomi's people arriving on the Island with knock-out gas and taking those people from the radio tower, but not knowing about those left on the beach.

Dang Admin, now you have me all worried about Hurley and Sun and Jin being separated and Kate and Sawyer and Rose and Bernard.

Twinkle said...

Jack was perfectly willing to leave everyone behind on the sub because he planned to go back for them. Maybe only Jack and Kate got off because the freighter couldn't carry more? (Oh and Aaron and Claire since it was in Desmond's vision.) Maybe Jack had to face the proverbial life raft situation?

bigdog said...

memphish, actually i can. he was going to do it once already before locke blew up the sub. maybe he had one more choice to make. he was prepared to let sayid and the boys die and let locke kill him. what if the next choice is leave now or be stuck forever.

Sayid'sgirl said...

bigdog said:
also it takes 3 years to finish the show. so did we just see the end of the show and know we are going to work backward from there?

That's what I'm afraid of because if that's what they do I don't think I would like it. I want to go from island time to future time. I don't want to know the ending of the show until the ending of the show. To me it would be pointless to watch if I already know what's going to happen in the end. I wouldn't care anymore how they got there. But I will reserve judgement until I see hwo they work it. That may not be what is happening at all. At least I hope not. I would rather have time travel over that.

sean said...

Maybe it will come to a situation where Jack and Co. have a very small window of opportunity to leave the island, and won't have time to take everyone. So in his despiration, he must leave some people behind.

I know JAck isnt the kind of person who would do that. But he just seemed really desperate to get off the island in last night's episode.

tnsmartfan said...

Why is Jack talking as though his dad is alive? Mikhail seems to be indestructable. Who was jac asking to forgive him before he jumped off the bridge? 15 inches on the map from the beach to the radio tower. Map also reads Pascal Flats-hmmm. Mikhail is not too good with the rifle. Des was a sitting duck. Why was Jack the hero twice over...what was the other heroic act-getting the survivors off the island? Or saving both crash victims? At first when Jack said to Juliet "don't do anything stupid"-I thought it was a threatening warning, but after seeing it twice-it looks more like a endearing protective thing. Maybe the obituary was Juliet's who died miscarrying a baby she and Jack conceived on the island. The girls underwater are also jamming Mikhail's transmissions. Not the sky turning purple. Hurley saving the day was AWESOME!!! I thought Alex asked a great question that I have asked-why ben can't just let them leave-interesting how characters are asking questions that fans want to know the answers to. The funeral was in a black neighborhood with a black funeral director so I guess it could have been Michael.-could have been suicide for feeling guilty for killing anna and libby. If our flash forward is truly that, Ben was lying saying every living person would be killed. Jack delivered a Rambo style threat to Tom, since we found out Bernard wasn't Rambo. What a great mother daughter bonding experience-tying up dear old false daddy. Sayid snappin the dude's neck was my favorite part-bad to the bone! Sawyer having a post butt wooping beer out of the dharma van-classic! Bonnie's numbers don't make any sense-melody only consists of 6 tones-Bonnie's code had 7 different digits in it. It seems ben knew that when the hatch blew up they would be vulnerable to discovery so he sent the women into the looking glass to jam signals to try to protect the island. Judging by the maps in jack's place he's been trying to figure out where the island is. What's Jack sick of lying about and who's Kate's HIM?

memphish said...

The only reason Jack was going to leave by himself on the sub was that he had no way to save others, and he thought by leaving that way and leaving with Juliet he would know how to get back. I don't see Jack leaving behind anyone at that radio tower, nor do I see him willingly separating Sun and Jin at the very least.

I like the idea that those at the tower are taken against their will because it explains why Ben would leave.

Twinkle said...

I hope not too, Sayid'sgirl. But I also highly doubt that. Regardless of the twists and turns, TPTB are giving us a modern fairy tale. No matter how "post-modern" you get a fairy tale still can't have a completely bad ending.

bigdog said...

great stuff here folks. got to make that long journey home.

it has been a pleasure coming here and sharing ideas about this show.

sayids girl - i hope not too, but at least there are still plenty of questions still to answer. PS your man was definately on his game last night.

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