Part 2 of the Podcast finale episode!
Don't forget to join us at TalkShoe on Wednesday, May 30th at 6pm (EDT) as we get your response to the season finale in a LIVE Lost Community Rehash. If you can't make it, you can still join in by sending an e-mail to TLCPodcast@gmail.com or by calling 732-564-4763.
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Tuesday, May 29, 2007
The Lost Community Podcast - Episode 26 B
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Here is the updated reading list for the 
209 comments:
1 – 200 of 209 Newer› Newest»Aaron also died in the wilderness...
from prior thread:
A nearby transmitter, even on a completely different frequency, can still interfere with a receiver if it is powerful enough.
Try making a cellphone call while standing next to the Z100 transmitter tower.
also from prior thread:
Bonnie and Greta: on assignment in Canada -- recruiting, maybe?
I guess it's all better now. Phooey on blogger.
From the previous thread. I think Bonnie and Greta were supposedly sent to Canada to inform and console Mrs. Rom (Ethan's mom) of his untimely demise. :)
Memphish,
I turned the comments on in the other post so you can post "first". :)
Not Pascal.... That was Rene Descartes. His reckoning was that the consequences of believing in God and being wrong were not as severe as the consequences of disbelieving and being wrong.
Engineer,
I've done that hundred's of times right below the Star 99.1 50,000 watt radio tower! Right next to the tower I have a hard time getting any TV recpetion and Radio Reception but it never effects my cell phone. In fact every radio tower in the country makes a nice chunck of change by offering space to cell and pager companies. They actually use the radio towers to broadcast Cell phone signals!!
Thanks Dennis, but I'll pass.
Obviously, Bonnie and Greta being on assignment in Canada was just a cover story for them really being in TLG. But if the Others bought the story, it would mean that periodically they do get off the island, most likely to recruit specialists (a la Juliet and Richard Alpert) as needs arise.
(Sorry I snuck in as First in previous post, Memphish!)
re: michael in the casket. If it is him, did he get off the island the first time?? If so that could be why no one wants to go.. they believe he didnt come back for them.
If did not make it off the first time, i dont think it would be him in the casket.
Re Charlie's predetermined deaths: All the flashes that Desmond saw of Charlie dying (lightening, saving Claire, getting the pidgeon) were meant to be stopped, since the most hiimportant "death" was flicking that yellow switch. Desmond was "meant" to save Charlie those times in order to prepare Charlie mentally to accept his death and get him to TLG and flip that switch.
Bigdog, I think Michael does make it off the Island following the heading 325. Then his "rescue" helps him set up a new identity and tells him if he ever mentions the Island, they'll turn over a tape of him shooting Ana Lucia and Libby from the Swan. I don't know how Jack and Kate would know this new identity though. Giant hole in my theory.
I really hope it's not someone new. I think there are enough people to work with already.
Admins, should the Episode 26 A thread still be open for comments ?
I'm sorry I had to split the podcast into two pieces but I tried to download the almost 2 hour episode as one intact piece (on my test feed) and it took over and hour. Steve and I didn't mean to go on so long but their was just so much to talk about
2 hour episode = 2 hour podcast David. No worries. After all we have 8 months to listen.
Erich
Alright someone else who also thinks there are other, others. I've always thought there were others who were still pure or savage if you will as you said ever since Eko and Jin saw them when they were hiding. I even posted it here some months ago near the begining of the season. But most here disagreed with me.
I don't know we could both be wrong but I still stand by it.
I've been thinking some more about Joseph Campbell's Hero Anaylsis which someone else referenced on the last thread. The book says that the hero path is a story of separation--initiation--return. In the last thread it was said that Future Jack is in the return phase and maybe part of the problem was he hadn't completed the initiation phase.
I'm even wondering if we're viewing the story upside down. Maybe it's not separation from the real world, initiation on the Island and return to the real world. Maybe Jack's (and the other LOSTies) story is separation from the Island, initiation in the real world in the form of the acquisition of faith and return to the Island.
Sayid's Girl and Erich, I agree that the barefoot, teddy bear dragging Others seem to be different from the J. Crew Ben Others, but I always have to fall back to the OLP where DL and CC have stated several times there are 2 factions of Others. I would not complain if there were Other Others though.
There was a review of Season Finales including LOST and Heroes in USA Today on Friday.
I'm not sure who you think the second faction of the others are.
Is it your belief that people who have split from Ben are the second faction of others? Because in my mind other than the possibility of Juliet and Richard I don't think anyone has split from Ben. They're questioning him but they are stll following him, so far. It's been my belief that the second faction is the other, others the pure group.
Yes Sayid's Girl, I'm assuming Faction 2 is a subset of Ben's Others which includes Juliet and whoever else wanted her to do her flashcards for Jack.
I can't decide where I think Richard falls. He's the one who installed Ben in power, right? Why can't he merely remove him? Is it Season 4 yet? I want a Dr. Eyeliner flashback.
My theory about the other others is that the black rock crew and possibly the original inhabitants lived on the island for some time (theories about them being immortal aside).
Then when Ben started talking to them, some saw something in Ben (maybe because of a prophecy) and started to work with and eventually follow him.
The other others are the ones from the original group who didn't agree with this (especially the purge) and are living in isolation, but take what they want when they want it.
Also I think that Ben's others are going to the temple and will meet up with the other others.
memphish
Yes a Dr. Eyeliner flashback would be good wouldn't it. But are we going to anymore flashbacks? I'm not so sure.
Can we call the other others the OO's ?
zort70
I could go with the decendants of the Black Rock possibly being a part of the other, others. You're saying the original inhabitants (and Black Rock people)followed Ben at first and then split from him early on. That the split has already happened. Then they went back to their pure ways. Do I have that right? I like that version too. I was thinking that some never did follow Ben, but it could have been your version too.
Sayid'sGirl: Good on ya for picking up on the OtherOthers so early! Now that we know more about Ben's ascension to leadership, it does make some sense. Either all the Hostiles got civilized with Ben and left their rag-wearing ways behind them, or at least some thought the move was a mistake. I suppose there's a third possibility that the Hostiles were faking it with the grungy look, like the Others were in the first two seasons.
Here's a scenario I like: Ben is seen as special and becomes leader of some of the hostiles, possibly spearheaded by Alpert. The recruitment of outsiders like Mikhail and Juliet is Ben's doing, co-opting the DHARMA vehicles, technology, resources etc. to fulfill whatever purpose the Hostiles were trying to fulfill, only using the advanced technology to try and do it faster/better.
But it goes awry when dependence on that technology starts to deteriorate the Others: women can no longer give birth, Ben gets cancer, etc. It's only now that Locke has suggested they need to get back to nature that things are starting to right themselves in Other-land. I definitely think the Others are going to try and patch things up with the OtherOthers, who are probably living at the Temple.
Maybe Jacob was/is a member of the OtherOthers who Ben kidnapped? Maybe the OOs' leader?
Sayid'sgirl - Yes thats my theory, that "The Prophecy" seemed to fit Ben and his actions and that the OO's went with this for a while and then decided that Ben wasn't who they though he was, maybe because they found out he was a liar.
Hi all!!
Just popping in to see what the discussion is all about.
Zort70 said...
My theory about the other others is that the black rock crew and possibly the original inhabitants lived on the island for some time (theories about them being immortal aside).
Then when Ben started talking to them, some saw something in Ben (maybe because of a prophecy) and started to work with and eventually follow him.
The other others are the ones from the original group who didn't agree with this (especially the purge) and are living in isolation, but take what they want when they want it.
Also I think that Ben's others are going to the temple and will meet up with the other others.
My thoughts exactly!!
By saying prophecy, I mean anything that might make them think that Ben was the one.
e.g. Desmond like flashes, Ancient word of mouth, even a time traveller (although I'm not convinced by this one)
TLC said...
Engineer,
I've done that hundred's of times right below the Star 99.1 50,000 watt radio tower! Right next to the tower I have a hard time getting any TV recpetion and Radio Reception but it never effects my cell phone. In fact every radio tower in the country makes a nice chunck of change by offering space to cell and pager companies. They actually use the radio towers to broadcast Cell phone signals!!
TLC... that's right. If you weren't also right under the cell phone base station, you would have a hard time making a phone call as well. It's analagous to trying to hear what your friend is saying a hundred yards away while your sister is screaming in your ear. In this case, the transmitter you are trying to hear is far away, and your very sensitive radio gets overwhelmed by the very near but off-frequency 99.1FM radio signal.
Note that it is not the power of the transmitter that makes the difference, but how much signal hits your receiver (vs how much of the desired signal is present). So while it would be relatively easy to block a radio on the island from receiving anything from the outside world, it would be very tough to keep all signals originating on the island from being received in the outside world. Any "jamming" signal would have to be equal or greater in power to the originating equipment, and very close (if not equal) in frequency. That's because at the off-island receiver, both signals would be about the same strength and therefore easy to separate if they are at different frequencies.
Also note.....(see later post, this one is getting long).
Erich
Those are all really good thoughts and I like them all.
zort70
I like your ideas too, very good.
It's nice to be appreciated :-)
Regarding AM/FM vs satcom: There is no fundamental difference between AM radio, FM radio, cell-phone, satellite, etc. They are all electromagnetic radiation, just at different frequencies (wavelengths). It is true that the optimal antenna for receiving EM radiation is 1/4 the wavelength, so the longer the wavelength, the larger the "optimal" antenna. Also, the atmosphere absorbs some wavelengths more than others. SatCom uses signals with wavelengths measured in millimeters for both reasons: the antennas are small (and easier to launch into space), and the atmosphere is fairly transparent at that wavelength (if it isn't raining too hard). AM radio has a wavelength close to 300 meters, which goes through the lower atmosphere pretty well but bounces off the upper atmosphere (the ionosphere), which is why you can hear Canadian stations in Florida. FM is about 3 meters long, and goes right out into space (but isn't so good for SatCom due to the large antenna size). FM is hard to pick up past the horizon without a repeater because the signal doesn't curve around like the earth's surface does.
Well, I guess there's nothing like a little science discourse to completely kill a conversation....
In other matters, anyone find any good links deciphering the whispers audible right before the Return of Walt (RoW) ???
Hey everyone!
I still haven't a chance to catch up yet, but I have something to share.
The Official ABC Radio Lost Recap has a couple of interesting comments in it:
But as we see in the FLASHBACK, rescue isn't all it's cracked up to be. We see a distraught, bearded Jack, suicidal and ready to jump off a bridge. We learn that he's an alcoholic, and he's addicted to pain pills - in fact, he steals them from the hospital pharmacy. His erratic behavior eventually causes him to lose his job. Then Jack makes a call and asks someone to meet him at the airport -- and it's KATE. We realize, at that moment, that this is not a flashback, but a flash FORWARD. This is the FUTURE -- a glimpse of the life that awaits Jack if he leaves the island. He tells Kate he's been flying on Oceanic every weekend, hoping the plane will crash, hoping to find his way back to the island. "We made a mistake," Jack says. "We were not supposed to leave." "Yes we were," says Kate. "We have to go back!" Jack yells, as Kate drives away. "We have to go BACK!"
Lose his job? I didn't catch that when watching the episode.
IF he leaves the island? Was this whole Flash-Forward a premonition?
Lose his job?
The ABC promo dept. exaggerates yet again!
engineer27 said:
Well, I guess there's nothing like a little science discourse to completely kill a conversation....
LOL no not really. I thought it was very interesting. I just didn't have anything to contribute other than the fact that I now know how I got a Chicago AM radio station on my car radio when I was a kid in Ohio.
sayid'sgirl: You might also be interested that the program that Sayid and Hurley picked up was likely on so-called "short-wave," which has a wavelength around 10 meters (it's short when compared to AM!). It has the same property of reflecting off of the ionosphere as AM band signals.
im gunna step into the fight.
put my foot down
look down the barrel of the gun
pee into the wind
on this OO talk.
right then.
Picsel Theory on Discovery of Island Magnifico 101 (Also known as Island of Muu - wikipedia it)
Black Rock goes sailing with happy bunnies and rainbows on board (not to mention Magnus Hanso)
Oh S*** WTF is going on? this is one heck of a "bumpy ride for a while"
AHHHHH where did this island come from? How did we get here? what the hell...we can't leave yet...meh... lets fornicate with each other and have babies, and our babies can have babies ect ect ect. hmm.... i know lets build a four-toed statue
A FEW HUNDRED YEARS LATER.....
BOOOOOM...alert! alert! some huge sub has made it onto my fricken island... how the hell? lets just leave 'em be what harm can they do? (Dharma Arives after extensive research by alvar to find his great great great grandfather)
ABRACADABRA!!! what the hell? they've built on our island....bastards....*evil stare* lets attack the f*****s.(jacob gets pissed at DHARMA for bulding hi-tech stuffs on his Invisible Utopia)
Ben arrives on island. Some decendant of the black rock (richard) notices he only has 4 toes whilst Ben clashes into him in jungle. HALELLUJAH! we found our saviour!
Ben kills father as right of passage - heck this has been a tradition for hundreds of years now.
all others bum ben and stay with him even mr Fountain of Youth Richard.
"History will repeat itself" - Benjamin Linus....for example....
Oceanic Flight 815 goes flying full of happy bunnies and rainbows (not to mention our losties)
Oh S*** WTF is going on? this is one heck of a "bumpy ride for a while"
AHHHHH where did this island come from? How did we get here? what the hell...we can't leave yet...Lets set up camp
Ben - Whats this? People pissing all over my turf that i stole when i faked i only had four toes? attack the f***ers - hmmm we cant go to jacob looking like this... like we'v been living in DHARMAville. lets put on these old rags and pretend we dont use electricity... NOW lets attack the f*****s and take their babies! I wants my own babies.
Locke: Hey guys!i wanna play! let me join
Ben: Shall we let him join
Richard and Tom: haha. umm he needs a right of passage ha..ha...umm...ha?
Ben: Lol at you Richard and Tom. but yeah! how about a swirlie? nah too 90's...hey i know! go kill your dad! heck its been a tradition for years...
Basically
Black Rock found island by mistake. They are the others. and the only others, they dress up crap on their way to jacob or incase jacob see's them. He dont like technology
Jacob=Smokey? Smokey cant get to DharmaVille (Sonar/Sonic Fences) to see Jacob's homies using technology so Jacob doesnt know. But he saw the plane... and BOY did the smoke not like that (look at screens from episode 1 series 1 . Smokey goes psycho pushing the plane around. pushes guys into the plane, thenspends a few days taking it out on the trees. Or chasing after Ethan on Ethans way back to OtherVille
Basically
Black Rock found island by mistake. They are the others. and the only others, they dress up crap on their way to jacob or incase jacob see's them. He dont like technology
Jacob=Smokey? Smokey cant get to DharmaVille (Sonar/Sonic Fences) to see Jacob's homies using technology so Jacob doesnt know. But he saw the plane... and BOY did the smoke not like that (look at screens from episode 1 series 1 . Smokey goes psycho pushing the plane around. pushes guys into the plane, thenspends a few days taking it out on the trees. Or chasing after Ethan on Ethans way back to OtherVille
Good afternoon gang: Like your discussions today about the other Others. I think they're all meeting up at the Temple to become one group again to work on preserving the sanctity of the island from the outside world (which is fast approaching). The Others and other Others might have a difference of opinion in the past about how to deal with things on the island, but now that the outsiders are coming, they've decided to bury the hatchet and work together again. I think people like Richard (after learning of the massacre on Lostie beach) will go to the Temple (be it another station or the ruins with the 4-toed statute) and work toward keeping the island pure.
oi mavvy.
commentr on my theoris :p
Picsel: It's just another way to say it! LOL Basically, some of the other Others didn't like Ben and his group taking over Dharma-ville and living the "life of luxury" and eating left-over chicken out of the fridge. They preferred to live the way the Natives have always lived...in harmony with the island. I'm just thinking that this encroachment of the Losties (who mostly want to get off the island) and outsiders have gotten Ben and his group to leave town and meet up at the Temple to work together.
I'm baaaaack!!!
Hide the women. hahaha. j/k.
i won't be on here for a few days.
reason being, i have to find a way to watch the finale now. so, can't read the "spoilerificness" of the boards. hahaha.
later.
Chucklez: Hope you had a nice visit with your daughters! How have you managed to have kept spoiler-free for almost a week!!!!!
Hey Eng27, thanks a bunch for the lesson on radio waves, etc. I just read it, so I was not here to comment. Fascintating stuff! So, spank you very much! :o)
One dumb question....so, the 'size' or wavelength of the frequency dictates the size of the antenna, or vice versa?
Thanks. :-)
busy busy maven! hahaha
chuclez3: Congrats on staying spoiler free, that is FABTASTIC. You could always stream the finale, unless you are wanting to wait for your VHS goodness. I got links if you want 'em. Welcome back.
Welcome back Chucklez3 hope you had a good time with your girls. And it is amazing you've kept spoiler free.
hey i just thought of something -
what the hell am i going to do on wednesday nights now?
:(
haha! just tooling around some of the TLE related sites ... anybody visit apollocandy.com lately? its a porn site now ...
Ewww...I still have my Apollo Bar! Yuck! LOL
I still have my Apollo bar too. I'm too scared to eat it given the memos from TLE.
I'm 2/3rds through the podcast and have a few thoughts.
1. I'm sorry Dark Angel and David (for the most part) didn't like the Flash Forward, but I loved it. Giving us an ending way before the end was a great twist I thought and I can't wait to see where it goes next. I don't think it will be The Nine. I don't think we'll be off Island with on-Island flashbacks. I think that the flash in TTLG was an exception like Desmond's flash in FBYE. I predict we'll pick up on Island at the radio tower, the beach and the temple and go from there. After all we've got from Dec. 2004 until Apr. 2006 to catch up to Jack's flash. Which is not to say we might not get aberrant flash forwards, but where they occur for characters we know too much about already (Jack, Kate, Sawyer, Locke, Claire to name a few) so much the better. I also predict that Desmond will be able to do something to change the future we saw in TTLG so that suicidal Jack wanting back on the Island is not where we'll end up in May 2010.
2. I don't know anything about radio antennas, satellite phone signals, etc. and am perfectly willing to buy that they needed to turn off the neverending Rousseau signal to use the phone. Thanks though to David and E27 for the info. on it all. A bigger problem to me was always why take 40 people to solve a problem 2 or 3 could solve. But I'll skip that for now as well.
3. I very much liked your segment Dedjezter, but if that was me you were referring to, it's pronounced Mem-fish. JK. Keep up the good work. It was so funny you called out Jay & Jack. I've been meaning to post about them stealing your idea ever since I ordered my new T-shirt.
4. I like David's idea that the Island is a fulcrum of sorts for the existance of the rest of the universe and thus its destruction would indeed end the world/s. I'm planning on reading at least part of The Dark Tower series over the hiatus. It's not on the TLC Book Club list, but if anyone wants to discuss, just let me know.
Looking forward to the rest of the podcast and congratulations Steve and Karen!
I usually only watch ice hockey once every 4 years, but if you want to mix the NHL with LOSTclick here.
Hey, Dark Angel, I too have my reservations about what the new flahes mean for the next season. But let's see what D&C are going to do. I also hope that they aren't going to turn this into The Nine.
Congrats to Steve and Karen!
Welcome home, Chucklez! Glad you could have some time with your girls. I have the finale on tape, so call me and we'll work something out.
Anybody else in the NY/NJ area willing to come to Long Island to (re)watch the finale?
DarkAngel,
You actually liked the Heroes finale... are you sick, do you feel okay, do you need to lie down... or is it just a British thing.
Re:Bear Mountain
I love that place. I have been going hiking and climbing in that area since I was a small boy. It's not the best climb in the area, but good none the less. The zoo leaves a little to be desired though.
Congrats to Steve on the proposal, I like that you actually put some thought into it, instead of just popping the question straight out. Good for you.
So you huys were at Central park... wish I had known who you were back then. What a time we had that day in the pouring rain. If ou happened to be online to get into the stage area before it started and just after it started to rain, you might have heard someone on line playing
Rain drops keep falling on my head.
That was me, and I got a few laughs from the group that was waiting.
RE: Timeline Plains.... Ugh another valid theory. Why can't we all be gullible and stupid... lol
My theory on Other other's is this... If the island is the original Eden then this might make sense. Adam and eve are rejected and sent away from the island, since then (by accident) is the only way to get to the island. I don't think that anyone there is a true native to the island and that the island actually collects people, because on the island you can't have kids. This is why Adam and Eve were sent away. It has collected The Black Rock, Danielle's Ship, The Losties, and maybe soon the rescue freighter. The problem is that with newer and newer tech, comes the abillity to get off the island, and this is why Jacob fears technology. It may allow people to leave. At the Temple I believe their may be Other other's that are not part of the Dharmaville bunch. They will however work together for a common good.
Also I believe that the factions TPTB mentioned were within the group itself. I believe this becaus of the TEDDY BEAR. The lil boy had it in the other 48 and also when he was seen in the Trial episode when Cindy says that they are their to watch, so I think it was the same kid with it when they passed Jin et al all that time ago.
RE: The runway. This is the same way that they used to make temperary runways in Africa. You break the gravel into the dirt and then when it rains the mud and rock bits become one and act almost as cement. Dirt runways have existed for a long time. Deep gravel might be a problem, but what they were making could deffinitely be landed on by small to mid size planes. I doubt that they could have landed a 747 there, but smaller delivery plains would be fine.
RE: The Freighter
It could be a Paik Freighter. I was thinking about this because of... in the first season there is a flashback with Jin where he is in Mr. Paiks office there was the two TV's with pictures of A ( Ibelieve THE ) island on them. He knows where it is all ready.
How long were Bonnie and Greta in TLG. My take on them was that they could have been just like Kelvin and were convinced they were down there to save the world, being original Dharma. If we had ever seen Kelvin interact with the others we might have gotten some insight in to this. He might have acted the same way B and G did when Mikhail showed up.
Apoolocandy a porn site... I went there the other day when someone was looking for TLE links and I saw the adult content warning. If you select enter, you get an error page and if you select exit you are brought to the Wiki page for Girl = Female child.
SO who knows.
Amused, let me know what the deal is. Same time prepare to be destroyed... lol... right Chuck.
Chuck, hope you had a great time with the kids. I have none of my own, but can't get enough of my niece, so I kinda know how that is. But not to the same degree, since I can leave her alone if need be... lol
I also wanted to know if nyone objects to my podcast music choices. I thought they have all fit very well with the content of the episode, but that is just my opinion.
Well c-ya
Sorry for the
GINORMOUS POST, I listened this afternoon, but had to go to class, so I had 6 hours to think about stuff... lol
thats right..... no one comment on my Jacob=Smokey theory, and the fact that the Others only dress ala cavemen when they exit the fences (that smokey cant get through)....until juliet did and she was chased twice in one episode then..
Jacob is smokey, or controls smokey, he is his eyes and ears. im gunna have to re-watch theepisode where eko died, but im sure he had a torch or something on him that was technological that would differ him to the first time he came face-to-face with the monster
ok umm.. he nad nothing technological on him... all he did was show no remorse for his killings to Hieronymus Yemi. who replied "You speak to me asif you are my brother" who runs off and leads his brother to a gruesome death.
also, im pretty sure if there were other othersAlex and karl would have been with them after everything that happened to them with Others Part 1.
Picsel, I don't think Smokey=Jacob but Smokey could be doing Jacob's reconnaissence. Smokey and Jacob are 2 of the biggest mysteries still out there and I don't think we've gotten enough info. to formulate good theories on them and how they relate.
I think the pirate clothes were stagecraft for the LOSTies only. They wanted the LOSTies to think they were ignorant hicks like Michael said at the end of Season 2. Or at least nutjob nature people like Danielle. Why the Hostiles dressed that way in the days of DI? Don't know. But Ben did not dress down or force Ben to dress down to see Jacob, so I don't think it was for Jacob. Nor for Smokey as evidenced by the clothes of the Others Caravan at the end of Season 3.
Chucklez, I also add my hopes that you had a great visit with your girls. And I hope you enjoy the Finale.
capcom said... so, the 'size' or wavelength of the frequency dictates the size of the antenna, or vice versa?
wavelength and frequency are mathematically related like this:
w * f = C;
C=the speed of light, which is constant (more or less). So the higher the frequency, the shorter the wavelength.
In order to receive a radio broadcast, you have to get the electrons in your antenna to vibrate in sync with the incoming waves. That's easiest if your antenna is long enough to contain a whole wave (or many whole waves). It also works well if your antenna is 1/2 a wave long, and pretty well at 1/4 of a wave. Smaller than that, your antenna becomes much less efficient, but it can still work. That's why your AM radio doesn't need to be 300 meters long for you to listen to Sports Talk.
darkangel
I wish you could come back to the TLC I always liked your post. Anyway even knowing you probably won't see this. I have to agree with you the whole flash forward thing kind of ruined it for me too. I don't want to they get off the island until the end of the series. I'm not sure if we'll have off island episodes with island flashbacks or if we'll have island episodes with flash forwards. Either way I just wouldn't like it. I mean really what's the point of the island parts if we already know they get off the island. If I know they get off the island ahead of time, I'm not really going to be interested anymore how they got there. I already know the end result so what's the point. Now that doesn't mean I won't watch season 4. Because I'm not sure the end we were shown with Jack is set in stone. That maybe it can be course corrected. Which could mean more flash forwards which I'm not wild about. Oh well we'll have to wait and see. Just my opinion.
That should say.
I don't want to know they get off the island until the end of the series.
David, can you post a link to the EW article that talks about the mobisodes? I tried to find it at EW.com from your description on the podcast, but couldn't find it. Thanks.
Sayid's Girl's posts brings up a good question. How do you want the show to end? We can discuss this from both ends -- What do we want? What don't we want?
TheBookPolice, this is for you. Yesterday I dropped my son off at camp and one of the boys in his bunkroom was named Emerson. I immediately wanted to ask his mother as in "Ralph Waldo Emerson?" What is the significance of naming him after a Transcendentalist? :D
He might have been named after the great racecar driver Emerson Fittipaldi.
Good call E27. More likely he's named after Teri Hatcher's daughter or something stupid like that.
Season 3 DVD info.
For those of a mathematical bent, here is a calculus-heavy Wiki entry discussing Quarter-wave antennas.
Hey all -
I haven't had time to listen to the podcast yet, but it sounds like a doozy! :)
I wanted to let everyone know, that due to popular demand, there have been some changes to the book list for the book club. A couple of people asked to add Alice in Wonderland and Through the Looking Glass in place of Catch 22, so I've gone ahead and changed the list on Amazon. I also moved Alice to September, and shifted Third Policeman to November. Here's the new list:
June - Watership Down
July - A Wrinkle in Time
August - The Wizard of Oz/Incidence at Owl Creek Bridge
September – Alice in Wonderland/Through the Looking Glass
October - Turn of the Screw/Of Mice and Men
November - The Third Policeman
December - Carrie
January - Lord of the Flies
Any objections, please let me know. Also, check out the list on Amazon listmania (The Lost Community Book Club). I have updated the list and added some "Extra Credit" selections - these are books that appeared in Lost, but were left out of the book club (mainly for being too long) or books that have been mentioned by the creators as being influences.
memphish - I took your suggestion and added the Dark Tower series, as well as The Stand. I think both tie in really well to the themes of Lost. And I'm happy to talk Dark Tower any time! :)
ded - I'd like to take the suggestion that you e-mailed to me, but I couldn't find the book - I sent you another e-mail today.
Any other suggestions, just let me know!
dedjezter said:
Also I believe that the factions TPTB mentioned were within the group itself. I believe this becaus of the TEDDY BEAR. The lil boy had it in the other 48 and also when he was seen in the Trial episode when Cindy says that they are their to watch, so I think it was the same kid with it when they passed Jin et al all that time ago.
It's actually the TEDDY BEAR that leads me to believe that it's not the same people. The Teddy bear in ...And Found when Eko and Jin go after Michael looks a little worse for wear to me even for 48 days. Then when we do see them again in Stranger in a Stange Land it's not dirty looking (I know they could have washed it)and it doesn't look like it has a rag agound it's leg. (although you really can't see the legs that well)I know that is not likely there are two bears out there that look alike but these are probably not the first childern they have taken. Even Ben said to Locke they'd done it before. Of course you could always go with the whole time thing the people walking through the jungle seemed to be older than the kids that were taken. Who knows. I'm going to be like Chucklez3 on this one with his purgatory theory. ;)
I am finally having some time to catch up on the podcasts. Congrats Steve!
memphish -What do we want? What don't we want?
Ill bite.
I dont want them to change the ending they originally planned. i dont want anything left unanswered. I dont want any sequels. personally i dont want jack to end up as the hero. i dont want sawyer & kate to end up together.
i do want to own the complete set of this series when its over. i do want locke to blow up more things. i want to know why patchy's eye is stiched shut. I personally want sawyer or sayid to be the hero of the show. I would love if the answer has been in front our eyes from the beginning and it all makes clear sense afterwards. I want Eko back. i want to go to hawaii. and when its all over i want to feel like i do today that i am watching one of the greatest tv shows i have ever seen.
memphish, i doubt this is what you were looking for but i really just wish we were getting ready for another episode tonight.
Mephish,
It's in Issue #936, and it's an article about how we watch TV differently! IT's an article about DVR and how things are changing on Television. It's mentioned near the bottom of the article.
Melissa_lossa, thanks for all the book club work. It's absolutely insane that I've read all the official books except "Owl Creek Bridge."
I'm working on Extra Credit books these days -- The Fountainhead and The Brothers Karamazov (at a chapter a day I'll be done in approx. 100 days.) After I finish The Fountainhead I'll be reading The Watchmen and A Brief History of Time and then start on The Dark Tower series. Anyone who wants to discuss can send me an email by clicking on my avatar to get my email address.
Oh, and Ange, my son loved "A Wrinkle in Time." Maybe kids should read it/hear it before they hit 6th grade. I like it again too except for the ending which was way too fast IMHO. 200 pages of buildup to end in about 3. I found one of the sequels on a bargain table, so we'll tackle that this summer too.
my reasoning that mike is lantham is that he is one of the only characters from NY and he is the only one that i know of that would be survived by a teenage son. It may also tie into our theories that they are incorporating stuff form tle cause they never really answered what that retievers of truth stuff about vincent was all about and vincent and walt played small but major roles thisseason, leading hutley to dharma bus and pumpimg up loocke to get out of the pit..,.
Thanks David and BigDog. BigDog, that's exactly the kind of thing I want people to post.
Here's my first crack at my own question.
What I want - At some level I want them all to live happily ever after, but I don't think that's what we'll see. I use to think I wanted them to leave the Island. TTLG has made me question if I want that.
Answers I want - All of them including Why is Smokey so erratic? Why did they want Walt? Where are Michael and Walt? Why Can't Ben let anyone leave? Guys where are we? That's just a few.
Things I don't want - Confusing timeline problems that include characters getting endless do-overs.
That's it so far. I reserve the right to add and subtract from my list. :)
Hi All, condolences to everyone for out first Lost-less Wednesday. First of many. :-(
Thanks Eng27 for the info, very interesting! What you said about, "That's easiest if your antenna is long enough to contain a whole wave (or many whole waves)" sort of opened up a better understanding about it for me. I'm pretty dense about electricity/electronics.
I agree with a lot of what you said Bigdog about what you would like. Especially, "I would love if the answer has been in front our eyes from the beginning and it all makes clear sense afterwards." Amen! I have a feeling that's what we will be thinking about a lot of it when it's all over.
Don't forget about "Lost Horizon" Memphish, it's a very fast read, and very similar to Lost.
2costa, be careful about telling who is in the upcomming seasons, some LoCos feel that it's spoilery, and can be very much so in some instances. You could put alink to what you read and then whomever wants to look at it can.
Is anyone here a writer? I have a Q about TPTB's writing style with Lost. Maybe I'll just ask Maven's friend over on his site about it.
memphish - LOL :) I was reading Watership Down last night, and I told my husband that I had to hurry up and finish, because memphish was almost done! He thinks its funny when I talk about you guys.
Oh, and he wanted everyone to know that he gave me Watchmen. :)
I just added Lost Horizon to my listmania list - we are going to be some busy readers this summer!
capcom - I am a writer, and I've written several plays and screenplays, so I'd be happy to tackle your question. :)
It seems some people are unhappy that the finale may have given away the ending of the show - but really, did anyone ever doubt that they'd be rescued? I've always assumed that rescue would be the ultimate ending. And although there may be more to come after the resue than I anticipated, knowing that the rescue happened doesn't spoil anything for me.
My theory is next season, instead of just flashbacks and present day, we'll have flashbacks, present day, and flashforwards mixed together. Which I'm okay with!
Sayidsgirl, I kind of agree with you about the flash-forward parts of the story. I don't think that I want to know too much about the end, even if TPTB make the "getting there" the crux of the story and show. Maybe I'm just caving in to a linear type of perception and not letting TPTB think outside the box for the viewers, but I'm not sure how I feel about the flash-forward yet. I thought that it was a great finale, and the Jack-forward was very intriguing and compelling, but.....**I'm scared!** :o)
Oh capcom -- only fools are enslaved by time and space. ;)
New Doc Jensen. Seems he can't stay away either.
Great Melissa, I'll ask you! I am just wondering about this particular style that TPTB have been using to reveal the story/show. The Pikki episode (I can't remember the name for some reason) is sort of an encapuslation of how they are doing the entire piece. First we saw Nikki stumbling out of the jungle and collapse (it began the story, but it was really the ending of events, as we later found out). Then we got some backstory of Pikki and some mid-island story, then we finally got the part of the story right before the ending that we saw in the beginning, i.e., she is poisoning Paulo and gets it herself, and then we finally understand what the scene of her stumbling out of the jungle was.
It seems as if TPTB are taking a story they have written that has, say, plot events #s 1-50. Pretend the pilot was #15-ish. Then during the course of advancing from #15, we get some of the previous numbers, and also, now, some of the later parts. Sort of like they wrote out the entire story/show, cut it up into little pieces, and strategically placed bits and pieces of the past and future inbetween the present parts.
I don't know if I have made any sense, but I don't think that I have ever seen a story revealed like this before and I find it fascinating. At first I thought that TPTB were just being coy, and teasing, and almost cheesy in their pre- and post-reveals that were answered later. But after watching the Pikki ep, it feels as if there may be some kind of definite style that they are using. I was wondering if this is a style that has been used for a while, or if it has just been created, not necessarily by TPTB, but just recently. Tx mucho, if you can make heads or tails of what I just said! :o)
Not vewwy funny Dr. Memphish Jones! :o) Heheh.
Morning all on the first of many Lost-less days! :( (Well, we did make it through the first week, didn't we? LOL)
Been reading "Wrinkle in Time". Looks like we've got the official TLCBC list AND the unofficial one to get through this summer! Yea!
How I'd like the show to end:
Pretty much how everyone else has said already. I want everyone to finally reconcile all their problems and issues and be happy after getting off the island. I think we all expect getting off the island will end the show. I don't want any loose ends dangling out there leaving us wondering whatever happened to so and so.... Obviously, we all want all the answers to the burning questions: Smokey, the powers of the island, Jacob, the 4-toed statue and Temple, how the Natives got there, etc., etc....
Good Wednesday, LoCoes!
Memphish, you put all us avid readers to shame! I am looking forward to this summer, and so is my 6yr old, 'cause we are going to the Library to get us some books. This is his first year reading; he can't wait to get his very own library card and have his own reading list (just like Mommy!) My dear girl, you have inspired me.
Chucklez has called me, and we are on for Sunday afternoon/evening. Dinner is included. So, Dedjezter, and anyone else interested, get my email from my blogger profile and contact me, I'll clue you in on the details.
Finale time!
Great question about the timeline of LOST Capcom. LOST's structure is definitely not linear. Even the flashbacks for the characters aren't linear. First we tended to see why the characters were in Austrailia and on Flight 815. Then we learned more about other events that shaped who the LOSTies are. One of my favorite flip flops was seeing Jack marry Sarah and then the next season seeing that she had been a patient of his.
I think this non-lineraity (made up word) is part of what makes the show so fun and so frustrating for viewers as we try in our own minds or on discussion boards to fill in the gaps that the writers have left us. I know that early in Season 3 I was frustrated with the show because I was coming up with options that I invested too much in and was ticked when TPTB went another, generally simpler way. I still feel that way a lot when it comes to Kate's character.
There are a couple of books in the LOST universe that have used similar non-linearity that I can think of. Catch-22 is one. Things take place out of order there a lot. Slaughterhouse 5 is another. Billy Pilgrim is no fool. :)
melissa_lossa
It's not the fact of knowing they get off the island that bothers me. It knowing what happens to them after they get off the island before they actually get off the island. I just wouldn't care anymore how they got off the island or what they went through. I would already know Jack's a drug addict. That Kate was with someone and seemingly happy. That maybe Jin and Sun have their baby and everything is alright. etc To me the island story wouldn't be important anymore. If they give us all the answers I don't need to solve the problem anymore. I guess I'm just one of those people who doesn't want to know the end until it's the end. Unless it started out as a retrospective to begin with. Which I guess maybe it already was with the flashbacks. I don't know it just seems with the future flashes that they haven't finished the island story properly. They're starting over with a new retrospective. I guess I'll have to wait until Season 4 to see what they are really up to.
bigdog said…I would love if the answer has been in front our eyes from the beginning and it all makes clear sense afterwards.
I completely second that. I want to have a bazillion “OH YEAH!” moments as I re-watch the whole thing when it is done (just like capcom had with Expose and Pikki). Also, thanks for your post, the way that you wrote it gave me a little chuckle.
memphish Incident at Owl Creek Bridge is very little and quick…you will love it. Although if Lost winds up like how it ends, I might die a little inside. As for Wrinkle, agreed that it needs to be read younger than 6th grade…loads of books need to be really. Watership Down is making me a little bit insane ATM, but only because those bunnies are really beginning to tick me off in their naiveté…but I am circling and noting away.
Melissa: way to go, girl! You are doing a bang up job of managing this Book Club. Kudos to you!
I just love how we can discuss things like radio wave technology to philosophy to literary style to zombies to religion to time travel theory to omg the list just goes on. And no one gets hurt!
This blog is the nicest place in cyberspace. And you all make it possible.
Yeah.
As for the end of the series:
What do I want?
I guess I want Jack and Claire to know their blood tie; Hurley to go home and do something really good with his winnings, but not to go back to mediocrity; Desmond and Penny to end up happy together; Jin and Sun to raise their baby without fear; Juliet to return to her sister. (and I secretly want her to end up with Jack, 'cause they deserve each other and I think she'd be good for him, but that's not going to happen, is it?}
I want to know what Smokey is, the explanation of the Statue, whose Temple it is, and why the Island is invisible.
I want Ben to die. Unless there's a REALLY GOOD EXPLANATION for all the nasty stuff the Others have been doing.
What don't I want?
I don't want their lives to be trashed. I don't want these people that I've cared about to end up not caring about each other. I don't want Jack and Kate to be the only ones who get rescued, for anyone else to die (except Ben), or for the story to be told from an inevitable hopeless ending. Damon and Carlton said in The Answers that if they get rescued "that's the end of the show". Please please please don't let the next three years be leading up to Jack and Kate's meeting at the airport. I'll scream.
Phew! Lots of thoughts, but you asked.
Please don't leave Jack in a self-made Hell!
sayid's girl - I get what you mean completely. I think that we can trust the writers though, to not show us the full picture until their very end. I mean, yeah we know that Jack is a drug addict - but why? What's happened in the meantime? And is this the final end, a step along the way, or only one possible outcome? I'm playing along for now, anyway!
capcom - there have been other stories told in such a non-linear fashion (although of course I can't think of any right now!). I myself wrote a play a few years back that told the story of a relationship from end to beginning. The first scene was the couple years after their divorce, and it went backwards to the moment where they first met. The interesting thing to me about the format, is that as time goes backwards, you see a lot of things that you assumed to be true, were not true at all. If you think about it, the whole show has been like this, from the very pilot (finding out that Kate was the prisoner jumps out as an example). I think that the show will continue in this fashion, only incorporating three timelines instead of two.
The hardest thing that I found was that if you go staright backwards, your final moment, the very beginning of things has to have a lot of punch, a big surprise. I think TPTB have solved this problem by not going in a linear timeline, either forward or backward. This style lends itself well to lots of surprises, and fits in perfectly with the idea of a group of people being thrown together. You wouldn't find out about someone's past from start to finish, you justpick up pieces as you go along. We as the audience are doing the same thing.
Does that in any way answer your question?
Re: flashforward are we at the point in the story that we have learned all we are going to learn from their past of the people still alive?
has bernard had a flashback? i know he was in rose's. we havent seen danielle. or maybe even a mr. eyeliner flash. since they are both getting alot of screen time.
Re timelines - that is one of the best part of the storytelling, we generally have to put it all together to get the complete pic. kinda like that last rblake video.
why would the island heal rose without her doing anything. it healed her and locke from the moment the plane crashed. And how did bernard learn of the place in sydney?
If you want to check out some mind-bending writing, I highly recommend Harlod Pinter. He wrote a play that inspired mine, I believe called Betrayal. I have the book at home, I can check the title if you want. There's also one called the Dumbwaiter (I think - in any case, it's about a dumbwaiter) that is really good.
RE: Non-linear storytelling -- Perhaps we need to add Wuthering Heights to the reading list!
engineer - NOOOOO!!!!! I have read Wuthering Heights twice - for classes both times - and I CANNOT handle it again. I know it's beloved and all, but it is not a favorite of mine.
m_l: Mine either. It just came to mind as a classic example of twisted timelines.
Okay, I have to get outta here. I'll try to be back on later.
See ya!
the flashes foward being regular next season was also confirmed.
Where 2costa and don't just give me BuddyTV because they don't cite their source either. DL and CC told Kristen at E! we're going into radio silence mode, there's no OLP because they are on vacation, so who is confirming?
amused2behere said:
Please please please don't let the next three years be leading up to Jack and Kate's meeting at the airport. I'll scream.
I agree with you 100%
melissa_lossa said:
And is this the final end, a step along the way, or only one possible outcome? I'm playing along for now, anyway!
I'm not convinced it's the complete end. I was thinking that it may be a time thing and him getting back to the island could be a course correct. Until I read your conversation on linerar writing I never considered that this flash forward could be any place in the future not necessarily the end.
I'm just one of those people who don't read the last page of the book because to me it would be pointless to read the book.
But I'm with you I'm playing along for now too.
Well it didn't take long to get our first spoilers for Season 4 :) One of the site Admins over at AICN posted the following. (Thanks to Lyly for the info)
JUST GOT CONFIRMATION
by The Real MiraJeff May 24th, 2007
07:12:42 PM
Next season of Lost will feature BOTH flashbacks and flash-forwards.
heres the flash foward thing, just because they are on vacation doesnt mean they didnt know whats in store for season 4 before they left
ya and your right that the e lady didnt site her sources on the harlod pereneau thing but i beleive it cuopled with the whole snippet text the paper it makes sense
whatyever mike real name is
2costa
I think the fact that Ben and Desmond already being on the show and telling us they would be there for awhile. Is different than finding out a character that's been off the show for awhile is coming back full time. It kind of bothers me to know ahead of time. I'd rather be surprised when he pops up and then wonder how long he would stay around. Like on finale night someone said that Malcolm David Kelley was in the credits during the show. I had heard rumors they were trying to get him and Michael P. for the finale but didn't know they had it kind of bothered me. I would have liked to have been surprised to see Walt.
And as far as the flash forwards being confirmed for nexted season if that's true thanks alot for that one too. Would have rather found out when the new season started up. Because that's one of the things I don't think I'm going to like.
Sayid'sgirl,
When Ben told Locke they had done it before, I took that to be him reffering to the tailies, not a previous group of crashers.
2costa,
They had said at the end of season two that mike and walt would be back in season 4, but not in season 3, What nails it for me is the fact that he turned down a chance to be in the finale. Hense the closed casket, they couldn't show mike in the casket, because he wasn't there to be in the casket, sure they could have used the look'a'like other and fixed him up a bit, but we would have figured that out... lol
I think it could also stand to reason that mike being back could just be a red herring to drive us all crazy...
And his name is Harold, not Micheal P... lol
What I want to see:
Hurley give Walt his $83,000 dollars and produce a tribute album to Charlie useing his writings from the island and giving the profits to Aaron.
Ben trapped off the Island with no way to return.
Danielle and Alex happy together.
Jack and Claire finding out they are siblings.
Sayid in Guantanimo Bay... ooooh sorry Sayid'sgirl... lol
and lastly... Locke sitting on a throne in a mysterious temple telling the others what to do. heh heh
Sorry I didn't mean to sound snarky. It's just the whole reading the last page thing again.
Sayid'sgirl,
SORRY... That was me who noticed that Malcolm was in the credits... sorry if I ruined the surprise, but it stood out like a sore thumb to me because I always look at the credits.
You're right Ded his name is Harold. I c ouldn't think of it and copy 2costa. It didn't sound right to me when I did.
As far as Ben meaning the tailie kids I guess he could have meant that. But that wasn't my first thought.
That's ok Ded :)
Me too on the snark thing. Sorry if I was harsh. The lawyer in me is needing citation.
Can we agree not to post anything from AICN over here? They are the ones who leaked the finale. I'm not passing judgment on those who like spoilers, but I don't want any. Merely posting there's something new on AICN is fine, but no details please.
Ded, you almost made me cry with this one: Hurley give Walt his $83,000 dollars and produce a tribute album to Charlie useing his writings from the island and giving the profits to Aaron. And I had Charlie in the TV Squad Death Pool.
sayid'sgirl/memphish: You didn't sound snarky at all and you said exactly how I feel.
This board is superb, but sometimes we need to remember to use caution, one persons technical details and cast lists are another's spoilers.
That's ok about Waaaalt!
Didn't finish reading your post before posting. So I don't want to see Sayid in Gitmo
2Costa, I've got a better source for you. Ausiello from TV Guide is reporting the same casting news you have as well as some more from CC. It's on DarkUFO's front page (which I've posted a complaining comment about.)
Thanks Ange
I felt like I may have went a little overboard venting.
I'm somewhat frustrated about next season.
to me, at least
just because sombody says "just got confirmation - it will have both" it doesnt necessarily mean so
oh wait...hang on a minute.. somethings coming through....
JUST GOT CONFIRMATION
The Series 4 Finale ends with a nuclear strike on the island, but its ok cus the losties escape and ben dies.
...see what i mean. :p. Don't believe it lol. they didnt get confirmation, but its pretty obvious there will be some. What i want to know is if any "flashbacks" from previous series or indeed this one are actually an unknown FlashForward...
Heck for all we know, when it shows us these storylines on island that mix with the "flashbacks" it could be just beginning to show the road between the island storyline and the future story line we are seeding in the "flashbacks"..
Sort of like the "flashbacks" explain the character in the islandstory and why they are behaving like this. But really they are flashforwards...showing us what will become of this behaviour they are showing... i dunno, but would be a big ":O" moment if thats what we discovered
memphish may I asked who/what is AICN I don't know.
Picsel, that's why I want to know the source. It it's Doc Jensen or Kristen or Ausiello who have access to CC and DL then I'll believe it. If it's a website touting themselves, I won't. I wonder if you can get anyone to bite on your nuclear strike theory. And I want it to kill Juliet too. :D
AICN = Ain't It Cool News
Thanks memphish
OOOH that would be hilarious. I think we should each come up with a crazy - yet slightly believable storyline for next season, and try and get it on a mention on one of the other Lost sites, or on a spoiler site XD
Picsel,
So are you laying the guantlet down. Who is the best fake spoiler writer? Sounds like something else we can do over the long break... lol
sounds good to me lol
Allright, I have actual questions for discussion from TTLG and want to hear from everyone.
#1. Was Walt really Walt or a manifestation?
#2. If Walt was a manifestation was it Smokey, Jacob, other? Explain.
#3. If Smokey/Jacob/Other can manifest itself to Locke as Walt, why doesn't it just take itself to the radio tower and manifest there?
#4 What will be the consequences to Locke and Ben of their failure to prevent Jack from making the call in terms of Smokey/Jacob/Other?
assuming that jacks flash foward is the "end " of the story is pretty close minded, there was no closure there at all. I also think it is simular to the trick they pulled with desmond saying charlie was gonna drown and the ben story that the looking glass was flooded seemed like the same thing but they wernt. In the same vein i think that the flash foward has a lot of people thinking that call jack makes to naomis people leads to at least his and kates rescue, but since the flash foward is three years later i dont thiink they are related.I agree this mike /obit thing jsut might be red herring. I put spoiler in front of most of that stuff and i did correct myself and put harold, but i just know him as augustus hillb from oz
i also think that jacob does not control the islands healing or jacob is not smokey, that is that same thing were we are supposed to make that mental leap, but it isnt necessarily so
the curious thing for me is that they are releasing this info about the obituary and perineau now with six months to wait for season 4, it almost makes me think they might have some summer tricks up there sleeves
1) I dont think it was Walt. It was a manifestation. the Walt i know wouldnt stand there going "get the hell up!" He would have gone for help or pulled locke out.
2) Personally i think it was a manifestation of Walt from Locke's mind. Or as he likes to call it "The Island" or as i like to call it the CharlieBox (Hieronymus Box) Locke really bonded with walt and truly believed he was special, and lockes sub0concious pulled Walt out of the box to help him in that depserte time.
3) Wasnt Jacob/Smokey. It doent manifest itself because nobody willed it enough to using The Island. Or didnt know how. Or didnt know about what was going on there.
4)Nothing. the nuclear strike will come to quickly :p lol. I dont know, i think smokey will bring Ben's cancer back.
desmond is the big x-factor. He has already proven he could change the timeline, it wouldnt take much from desmond to change what happens in the flash foward of jack
rememeber the first episode of the season during the book club, when jullitette said " excuse me for thinking there is still free will on blank island" i think this might tie into the stuff we dont know about the island and all the fatalistic things that happen
i think jacob and walt may have the same powers, perhaps their astral projections transcend time and space, perhaps that was walt from three years in the future projecting back to change the timeline as jacob may be projecting foward
i meant whatever blank was gonna be
Picsel, great answer #4. I like the idea that Locke's own mind gave him what he needed to move past suicide and get back on his "journey." I still have a hard time reconciling Locke's knife in the back for Naomi, but nothing for Jack.
#1. Was Walt really Walt or a manifestation?
I think it was really Walt. He knows much more of what is going on than we do, he is special, and has appeared in places before.
#2. If Walt was a manifestation was it Smokey, Jacob, other? Explain.
Niether, it was a manifestation of himself, by himself.
#3. If Smokey/Jacob/Other can manifest itself to Locke as Walt, why doesn't it just take itself to the radio tower and manifest there?
Walt has a direct connection to Locke, because Locke is special as well. It makes me think of the scene from season 1 where Walt is talking to Locke and everything is just fine and dandy, then when Locke touches Walt he immediatly knows about the Hatch... maybe they share a connection that allows Walt to contact Locke, but know one else.
#4 What will be the consequences to Locke and Ben of their failure to prevent Jack from making the call in terms of Smokey/Jacob/Other?
This one I have no guess for............ YET!
have you ever read over the whisper transcripts there are some interesting things there. It reminds me of the coruses from greek tragedies how they have a god like perspective sometimes and they are commenting on the action, It almost seems like the people that trancend the time line are watching the action
Yes 2costa, the whispers transcripts are interesting. I check the Fuselage every once in a while to see what progress they've made. I can't wait to hear what happened before Locke saw Walt and the rest from Ben's flashback.
i really think that pit was a blackhole where the islands healing couldnt reach, although i know it could be argued i dont think the location of lockes wound would take his legs from him again. Ben already knows locke can heal the reason he picked that spot is that he knew he wouldnt heal right there. Walt had to convince locke to swallow his pride and crawl out with his arms, when he exited the pit he seemed to heal very rapidly.
thery ar eon drak ufo memphis
Ded, here's a follow-up for you. Where was Walt manifesting himself from? Is he in the real world? On the Island? On Chucklez' Island #3? Dead?
Ooh hangon, someone mentioned plays, films or books with messed up timelines
Blood Brothers, 80's english play by Willy Russel tells us the end at the beginning but then explains it all
Mission Impossible 3: havent seen it, but a friend told me that it shows the end at the beginning....hangon wasnt that written by a certain JJ Abrams??
the ben flashback ones are up
Center
1 Your hope is here (12 sec)
2. there ain’t no turning around (12.2 sec)
3. sounds like “turn to that screen” (12.3 sec)
4. Don’t forget him (13 sec)
5. Is anyone awake (15 sec)
6. We should take him (16 sec)
Little Ben: Mom (20 sec)
Right channel
1. What’s happening
2. If we go over there we might be able to see him but I don’t know (12 sec) man’s voice
3. Did you hear about him (13 sec)
4. Is anyone on (15 sec) girl’s voice
Left
1. sounds like “disobeys you” (11 sec)
2. because the moment’s bad/rare (13 sec) girl’s voice
3. that’s what I mean (14 sec) girl’s voice
4. It’s heavy (15 sec)
5. don’t worry (16 sec)
6. sounds like “I looked through them (16.2 sec)
Rvturnage:
Center (these are the hardest to hear...very faint)
full scene audio
1. Talk to him (11.10)
2. Tell him that you're his mother (12.1)
3. Tell him to be patient (14.9) this mp3 also has # 4 on it...
4. That'll just make it worse (16.29)
{Ben: Mom?} (20.1)
{Mom Vision: Ben Don't!} (27)
{Ben: Mom...} (33)
Mom Vision: { It's not time yet, Benjamin.} (34.5)
Front Right
full scene audio
1. What's happening (11.19)
2. If we can go over there we might be able to see it, but I don't know (11.75)
3. help us come through the fence (13.7)
4. we're sending one, don't argue ( 15.3)
Front Left
full scene audio
1. (..tell you) I'm glad you decided to see me/ to send me/to send him (10)
2. Because I love him (12.6)
3. That's right, that's what I mean/That's right, that's what I need (13.15)
4. ____ (15.1)
5. Don't worry about it (15.5)
6. You're the one ....(16.3)
tell him your his mother and help us come in the fence stand out to me
i actually think by those messed up talkings lol.. that Ben has 4 toes. and is now the Other's messaiah... Also the Other's we know dont seem to incorporate this backwards talking normally now we've seen them?
As much as i dont believe in the Other Others malarky, maybe thats something they do, the ones that ar emore at one with the Island
2 Costa, that's one of them. There are several others that there are not done yet. If you click here, you'll get the main whispers thread from the Fuselage. This post has the Season 3 checklist.
The transcript you posted is from where Ben sees his mom at the fence. There are also whispers when he meets Alpert that I want to hear.
me too memphis you know whick ones are really informative when eko see the smoke wityh charlie in the tree
MR. EKO & THE SMOKE MONSTER
Episode: "The 23rd Psalm"
Combined Transcripts By 'Penyours' & 'RVTurnage'
Download Penyours MP3's
Download RVTurnage MP3's
(Facing off with Mr. Eko)
Who are you and why are you here?
Report, report!
Saw Charlie with him
There’s charlie
Go to hell
Steadily
------
(Within the smoke)
He’s trying here
Nothing yet
Now try him from here, okay
Those are the roles (or rules) you accept
Go to hell
(said with Eko’s accent)
Nine
Where
Seven
He’s hiding something
He’s hiding from me
the fact that the smoke knows charlie already
AUTOPSY TAPE
Episode: "?"
Combined Transcripts By 'Penyours' & 'RVTurnage'
Download MP3
Doctor: This is a Caucasian female. She's 161 cm, 51.3 kilos, body prepped and washed by the very lovely Valerie McTavish
Assistant: Ian, stop it
Doctor: Commencing with the post
Whisper: That's her (or) That's enough
Doctor: This is a clear case of drowning. I'll begin with a thoracic...
Charlotte Malkin: John! (screaming)
Whisper: She's alive
Whisper: How will we know
Assistant: Oh my God!
Doctor: Valerie!
Assistant: She's Alive!
Doctor: I think she's trying...
Charlotte Malkin: Let John Locke go (on)!
Whisper: She's not dead
Whisper: I found it
Doctor: Try and calm down
(Assistant screaming stop, stop)
Doctor: Valerie get... she's crying, don't just stand there do something!
Whisper: We’re sending them in (or) Let’s hear what she says
these are weird cause it wasnt even on the island
Happy Lost Day.... NOT! ohhhh, sad me....
Been away for awhile, but almost caught up. Hope everybody had a great Memorial Day Weekend.
I've been working on a new Crazy Theory and these whispers transcripts are fitting right in, thanks!!!
I don't think the flash-forward we saw in the finale is showing us the end of the series. It's showing us the mid-point (real-time).
capcom the elders of tralmaphrdore from slaughterhouse five was what i was thinking too with the way that look at time all at once, if it were a book or a song they would look at it all at once enjoying the peaks and valleys of the piece as one thing
i agrre codys mon jacks flight was in febuary 2007 so if the series goes to 2010 there will be three more years of stuff to fill in from there
the timing is part of why they cant have a tle2. If they eventually tie in the lost experience jack being still alive could still fit cause it is months after the tle, but if they did stuff this summer they would have to account for the fact that survivors were found since the last installment and it would paint then too much into a corner
I think the secrets lie with Richard Alpert and Co. He set up Ben and now he's setting up Locke.
I think only a handful of people get off the island. Obviously, Kate and Jack and I'm thinking Ben. I'd like to see if Ben finds Annie. I think he made a deal with Alpert before the purge to get her out of there.
2costa i think your confused.... the fact that this was three years later after the crash shows a future three years away... or a month ago in real life.
TLE took place last year in 2006 REAL TIMELINE.
Crash happened in 2004,and in 3 years of viewing LOST only 80ish days have actually passed. So they are in January of 2005 (or there abouts) Early '05 late '04.
So by the fact 3 seasons is 80ish days they arent going to suddenly dramatically increase the timescale they are covering. Think Of Mice and Men. the whole book was over 4 days. kept the action close together and everything. So by the time they get off of the island it will be mid-late 05 MAYBE early 06.unless something HUGE happens with time travel on the island... by the time TLE happened. whoever comes off the island, was already off, or on their way off. Therefore by doing TLE2 they will be doing it 1 year after they were discovered, and 1 year after the fall of THF.
By this timeline.. they can do whatever they want.
What strikes me is, that by the time Rachel Blake started messing about in the island the Losties should have been disocvered, unless they stay on the island. So why didnt she include them? or ATLEAST mention them on a mysterious island with the DHARMA initiative.
But one thing we can draw from this is that the island was still in existence in 2006 because THF was planning to send more people there under a new DI.... why has it taken them 3 years to still not even know DI has been compromised on the island? But still.. TLE 2 is a possibility.
i think your confused picsel all we know is that jack and kate are off the island in febuary 2007 which is after tle, the fac that jack hasnt met the new cheif erlier shows me he hasnt been back very long for all we know the have beeen back two months which would still be after tle
#1 I think it was a manifestation.
#2 I think it was a manifestation because you hear the whispers right before you see him. Hey maybe Richard was a manifestation when he met Ben.
#3 I think this occurance only happens with people who are considered special.
As far as Locke not harming Jack. Locke believes they were all brought to the island for a purpose so maybe he didn't harm Jack because he has served his purpose yet.
maybe jack and kate got saved on the helgus antonius, thats why i meant that they are not going to get saved by naomis people and ther is no way of knowing when desmond saw claire on the helicopter anyhow could have been 2 years later. The signal would have needed to be unjammed either way,plus as far as i know the island magnetic properties will still make it hard for a craft to get there in one peice
i think you got duped into thinking they were getting saved right away. In my mind naomis people want to find the island not the survivors, and maybe they are the evil people that want jacks nephew.
but we have three seasons left. just 48 episodes. out of thethree seasons we've had so far.. by their timeline we are in Early 2005. 2 years ago.
As a writer it would make no sense to spend three years writing to a very clse toether timeline and then halway through speed the whole thing up to get to an end...seems rushed to me. It would seem as though they would be rushing to the end they want.
Unless they drastically changed any sense of time they have used throughout LOST. anybody who leaves the island will be off by mid-late 2005.
TLE started in early-mid 06 and finished mid-late 06. So unless nobody from 815 leaves the island theyare off before beginning of TLE. That, or none of them decided to say "we were on an island that cant be seen where polar bears rampaged and black smoke attacked people" XD
but still.
and if the flashes fward are always gonna happen why didnt charlie get an arrow in the throut, causee they can change
are the whispers just there for the intense fans because until i read those i would not have thought about them at all. i know a casual fan would have no idea they were actual bits of info.
so we have ghost on the island as well as the invisible man. it is going to be a long hiatus.
maybe the flashes foward will do that picsel
i dont think they are ghosts they are course correctionists
Here's the timeline stuff as I perceive it and I have not gone to Lostpedia to confirm. Plane crashes late Sept. 2004. Jack makes call just before Christmas 2004. Approx. 92 days on-Island.
Other articles in future Jack's newspaper were dated April 2007. KRZR phone introduced Oct. 2006. So showtime has almost caught up to realtime, 1-2 months off.
TLE took place May 2006-Sept. 2006. It has never been confirmed that Mittlewerk's Island is the LOST Island. In fact, I don't think it is. I think TWM is going to a different Island with a greater population than the LOSTies Island. If his mortality rate is 30% statistically speaking he needs a pretty good amount of people for his data to be statistically significant. Also, the Sri Lanka video either states or strongly implies that TWM has made advance arrangements with the population of the Island. Futhermore, we've seen no macaques on LOST.
I think it is the LOST island.. that was the point in TLE... to tell us things about the island we wont find out in the show. Woulld need a TLE 2 to tell us it wasnt the island.
Actually, I think the point of TLE was to let us know something about the Dharma Initiative.
I like this from Doc Jensen's latest article, "Flash-Forward Thinking":
..."what we REALLY saw in that flash forward was the beginning of a new Hero's Journey."
Picsel, TWM says in the Sri Lanka video: The villages of Filan and Vetul-Milani have allowed us to test our vaccine on them. They think they are infected by a virus carried by local macaques and they believe we are bringing them the cure, Are there villages on the Island other than Dharmaville. Ben may be evil, but would he work with a mullet, pony-tailed, degree-lying scientist?
ah, more than 1 island?
reminds me of science class learning about the universe
there is a theory that says that the universe is forever expanding. Like a bubble, growing , but there are other universes other than ours. All of them expanding, and eventually they will all get so big some of them will begin to grow into each other and merge when the outer wals of each universe collide two universes become one. There could be hundreds of these islands. Island Filan and island Vetul-Milani
then again they could just b evillages
Thanks everyone for the replies to my Q about TPTB's writing style. Yeah, I've seen and read a lot of non-linear movies/books that jump around a lot, and I never liked that, it always messed up the flow for me. One movie in particular, was Crouching Tiger. It really threw me off when the movie went back in time to the Gobi desert, my head didn't make the right jump to there at all, until much later in the flashback. But I do seem to like it with Lost. Maybe TPTB are just doing it better with their writing? I dunno.
2costa, I don't mind too much about knowing who's in upcoming eps, but some people here do and we have kind of agreed not to mention cast lists for future shows. :-)
Re: the other others…. D&C (in“The Answers” ) said, that the others were “a group of 30-40 people…..we think”. That left a lot of room for speculation…I like many of the theories here, but will add one that I haven’t seen yet. My theory is that the Other Others are Nadia, Mrs. Hawking, maybe even Libby… they were/are those in the ‘real world” who course corrected our Losties… just like Des with Charlie…on their way to the island.
Then, sigh… I have to admit publicly, that I liked The Nine- for the sake of decompressing after Lost (no thought involved!). So, perhaps… I am a post that should be skipped over from now on!
But, with that said, ditto on BigDog’s wish list plus.. I want course correction for Jack (I agree Cody’smom, the flashforward is a midpoint, I hope!), who Jin’s daddy really is… I want Claire to find the DS ring and Des to have a dry-readable Greatest hits list….like Memphish, I want Happily ever after and for everyone to be reconciled with each other and their own issues, but likewise don’t think its going to happen.
I want “I can’t believe I didn’t see that” moments vs. weird add ins or sci fi to explain things in a pinch. I don’t want to be as disappointed as I was at the end of Twin Peaks. Please no parasitic Bobs.
I’d like to be able to keep up with this blog (so that my comments aren’t so stale), get these books read, and yet still get my work done, house cleaned…. I'd like to have the Sawyer or Jack dilemma that Kate has struggled with (poor, poor woman...yeesh!)...hmmmmm...oh, that's not what you meant when you asked the question???
LOL Lisa for that last one.
did i just dream it or wasnt marvin candle supposed to be in the finale in the present and werent they gonna show how he lost his arm, i thought i remembered an interveiw with the acter saying it was fun to work with the present day cast.
sorry actor, my spelling is horrible coupled with my manic typing its hard to read many of my posts, once someone on here asked me if english was my second language, suffice to say its my first
#1. Was Walt really Walt or a manifestation?
I think he was a manifestation.
#2. If Walt was a manifestation was it Smokey, Jacob, other? Explain.
Walt was a manifestation of Locke's own doing. He and Walt always have had a special connection. (Remember in the first episode Locke wants to know if Walt wants to "know a secret".) Lying in that pit, about to pull the trigger, he manifests the one person on the island that can convince him to go on.
#3. If Smokey/Jacob/Other can manifest itself to Locke as Walt, why doesn't it just take itself to the radio tower and manifest there?
Because Locke is the one that must try and stop what is happening at the radio tower. It's something he must do, urged on by Walt.
#4 What will be the consequences to Locke and Ben of their failure to prevent Jack from making the call in terms of Smokey/Jacob/Other?
Well, Jack threatened to kill Ben once they were rescued and he has seen them leave the island. We don't know yet what exactly this "rescue" is, so Jack might not be able to kill Ben. If Ben lives, he most likely will be overthrown by the Others and the other Others at the Temple. Locke might be destined to wander around the island, having failed to stop Jack. He might watch everyone leave (or get killed in a purge), and spends his life on the island as a recluse/hermit.
Im in the minority, but i liked the second season Whindom Earl twin peaks. Ironic that Damon gave credit to Twin peaks as one of losts inspirations and Agent Cooper did the narrations for the clip shows of lost this season...
HAPPY LOST DAY LOCOS!
oh wait...
Has it been a week already??!?!?
2Costa, I have deleted some of your posts that contain spoilers. Please read the TLC spoiler rules if you have any questions. Thanks :)
Twinkle said... This is for you, Young Wallace, Cody's Mom, and TLC: 54, 68, 65, 20, 6D, 75, 73, 69, 63, 20, 65, 6E, 64, 65, 64, 2F, 54, 68, 65, 20, 62, 61, 62, 79, 20, 63, 72, 69, 65, 73, 20, 6C, 69, 6B, 65, 20, 68, 65, 20, 6B, 6E, 6F, 77, 73, 2F, 43, 68, 61, 72, 6C, 69, 65, 27, 73, 20, 47, 72, 65, 61, 74, 65, 73, 74, 20, 48, 69, 74, 73
Code message AND a haiku? Love ya, Twinkle :)
capcom said... Did anyone catch Joel McHale's Lost recap on the Soup? It was funny, he went thru the recap and when he got to mentioning the flashforward he said, "...and they didn't even have the decency to say 'spoiler alert' first!" (about the flashforward). Of course, it was funnier when he said it. :o)
I have uploaded the Soup clip to YouTube
Thanks for posting that Dennis. I had looked for it yesterday and couldn't find it. Where are the LOST obsessives when you need them? Right here at TLC. ;D
yay people talking :D hehe
whats with the
"The music ended/The baby cries like he knows/Charlie's Greatest Hits"
lol. i still think we should make a Fanfic ARG. after my exams si might start writing one, and then put it into practice. would anybdy be interested in playing?
Memphish, I recorded it over the weekend, I just forgot to post it. Thanks for reminding me :)
2costa said... Im in the minority, but i liked the second season Whindom Earl twin peaks. Ironic that Damon gave credit to Twin peaks as one of losts inspirations and Agent Cooper did the narrations for the clip shows of lost this season...
Love Twin Peaks!
Kyle MacLachlan only narrated the most recent "clip show" - LOST: The Answers, not LOST: A Tale of Survival (narrated by Michael Emerson), or The Lost Survivor Guide (narrated by DL & CC). I'm sure he was easy to get since he's on another ABC show.
Did you see Inland Empire?
DON'T FORGET... THE LIVE TLC PODCAST IS AT 6:00 PM (EDT), which is in about 30 minutes!
I hope everyone can make it!
Ahhh but im watching the Desperate Housewives finale... lol ahhh XD
save it for me :) put it back about an hour and a half :p
would anybody play an ARG if i managed to put one together? over the hiatus
Ahhh but im watching the Desperate Housewives finale... lol ahhh XD
save it for me :) put it back about an hour and a half :p
would anybody play an ARG if i managed to put one together? over the hiatus
picsel said... i still think we should make a Fanfic ARG. after my exams si might start writing one, and then put it into practice. would anybdy be interested in playing?
That would be fun. Would it just be Lost related puzzles? Obviously, you don't have any information about the show to reveal. Unless you just make stuff up. Maybe you could flush out your nuclear strike story.
I'm always up for solving puzzles. I even have a few ideas for some of my own, if you want some help.
well im sure i could come up with something either based on lost, or more of a storyline to do with lost like rachel blake, we'll see.
Yeah help would always be needed from people, web deisngers, flash designers, anybody lol
just going to see who would be interested first
thanks memphish :)
i wanna start on ideas now, but i have the biggest exams of my life over the next three weeksm so gunna start after them otherwise i'll mess them up lol
thanks for the info though :)
Picsel, last I heard we were positively made of time. Charlie Pace and me.
memphish said... Allright, I have actual questions for discussion from TTLG and want to hear from everyone.
#1. Was Walt really Walt or a manifestation?
Manifestation
#2. If Walt was a manifestation was it Smokey, Jacob, other? Explain.
The Island, acting on behalf of Jacob. Ben said "Well I certainly hope he helps you, John." Be careful what you wish for :)
#3. If Smokey/Jacob/Other can manifest itself to Locke as Walt, why doesn't it just take itself to the radio tower and manifest there?
I don't think it likes crowds. John is a believer, so it is easier for him to see the island's visions.
#4 What will be the consequences to Locke and Ben of their failure to prevent Jack from making the call in terms of Smokey/Jacob/Other?
"I have a feeling that Jacob is going to be very angry". :) Maybe he'll crash the freighter or the rescue helicopters. I don't think he likes pilots.
Dennis, you've been messing with my timeline again!
:) Caught again!
lol.
how was the podcast?
good times :)
It should be available soon...
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