Tuesday, March 10, 2009

The Lost Community Podcast - Episode 57

Join Hosts David A Dein and Steve "The Goog" Guglich as they unlock the mysteries of Lost. Along the way they postulate that the island may be inhabited by Gelflings and offer song dedications to their friend Kyle.

If you'd like to be a guest on the podcast, have any theories, discover any clues, or just want to say "Hi!", contact TLCpodcast@gmail.com (mp3 comments are accepted as well), or leave a voice mail or fax at (206) 202-3512.

Episode 57 - LaFleur

137 comments:

Zort70 said...

I've just watched the Man Behind the Curtain again, and I do have a couple of issues with the timeline here.

Horace was with Amy in LaFleur, about 1977 ?

When Ben arrives on the island Horace is with Olivia, at least that is the implication.

Ben lives there for quite some time as he has aged considerably from the small boy to the Man that kills his father, which is said to be 1992 in Lostpedia.

Work that backwards and Ben must be about 20 years older during the purge than when he arrives, however I'll be generous and say he has aged badly on the island and it is only 15 years since he arrived. That makes it 1977 when Ben arrives.

Horace is off the island with Olivia when Ben is born, and she is then back on the island in 1977.

Something isn't right there.

Zort70 said...

I thought after typing that message, that someone else would have posted, so first ! and second !

Zort70 said...

I think that the implication is the thing that is throwing me, Olivia and Horaces relationship isn't established apart from the PopUp on an enhanced episode so I'ts just another Lost mystery at the moment.

Can we call them Losterys ?

Sayid'sgirl said...

zort
The whole Olivia/Amy thing is bothering memphish too.

Horace and Olivia are together when Ben is born but they are never seen together on the island.
I never thought Olivia was Horace's wife until the popup episode that said she was.

In the Feb. 5 LOST podcast Damon said they were friends. However he may of mis-spoke because he was kind of poking fun at a question from a viewer.

I also assumed it was early '70s when Ben came to the island. "71 or '72. I'm not sure why.
I'm not sure which episode it was in but the popup said Ben was 10 when he came to the island. I thought he was at least 12. But who knows.

Capcom said...

Good word Zort! :-D

About Ethan's age and being a surgeon as per the previous thread, just because Ethan is a "surgeon" on the island for the Hostiles doesn't necessarily mean that he is skilled enough to be a licensed surgeon in any civilized country. And for all we know he might not be a very advanced one, maybe just one with enough anatomy and surgical training to satisfy the island community needs. So we wouldn't really need to assume that he's had the usual length of professinal training to qualify for world class status. Just a thought. ???

Ellen said...

Here for email! The podcast was great!
xxoo

Ellen said...

Somehow, Ethan being Amy & Horace's child just doesn't sit right. I don't know, I just don't see it, and I am not sure what to believe as far as Olivia is concerned. I always had the impression that we could sort of depend on the pop-ups to at least give us accurate information, but maybe not. So I guess there is no point in painstakingly watching the "enhanced" episodes anymore, huh? (not good, not good!) Anyway, finished with the rant...:D

Capcom said...

That's what I've figured about the pop-ups too this season Ellen. And if something "pops up" that we can actually hang our hopes on, it will be posted on Lostpedia and discussed. :-)

Melissa_Lossa said...

capcom - good point about Ethan. I've always thought it was weird that Ben sent Ethan to collect intel on the Losties, putting their only doctor in harm's way. I mean, we've gotten an answer as to why he sent Goodwin, but why Ethan?

That being said, I don't think that Ethan is Amy and Horace's kid. The actor who plays him is in his early forties, so I don't know if there would be THAT much of an age difference between him and Ethan.

lost2010 said...

Wildly speculating - - if it is Ethan - - and if he knew Sawyer when he was a kid. . . .maybe they sent him because he'd recognize Sawyer. . .

And he got distracted by Claire being pregnant and him really believing she was in danger. . .

It would really be a huge Lost-worthy twist is the original person who made us think the Others were bad, turned out to be not as bad as we thought. . . or at least to have conflicted motives.

Melissa_Lossa said...

lost2010 - did you watch the mobisodes that were out last year? There's one that has already turned my thinking on Ethan a little bit (I think it's called something wacky, like "Ethan, meet Jack... Jack, Ethan").

I won't give it away, in case anyone doesn't want to know, but I have a little soft spot in my heart for Ethan now.

Capcom said...

That's an interesting point, Melissa. I didn't know whether or not to believe Ethan about that, cuz you know he didn't want the rescue to happen, so maybe he was lying about that too. But maybe that's why he went so kookoo for Claire and Aaron and went all maverick with that plan? Hmm.

If anyone wants to check it out, Dennis' mobisode blog is here:

http://lostmobisodes.blogspot.com/

2costa said...

zort ben was born in the early sixties and if he was 10-12 when horace recruited his dad, that would put him coming to the island in say 1972-1974. the purge was 1992 i believe, so that would make ben roughly 38 during the purge. That would make ben roughly 50 when we meet him in Rousseau's net, maybe 45 if we play with the numbers.

I think now that we know that tunesia is the islands exit door, and widmore made it sound like the only exit as far as turning the wheel goes, then it is even more curious that The tunesian hotel clerk said ben's alias was registered a couple weeks earlier. Ben said he hadn't been to tunesia for a long time. The fact he had been there before seems to show he has turned the wheel once before or at least used the orchid to go to tunesia. this brings me back to Ben's apparent age. He doesn't seem 50, but we all know after he turned the wheel he lost roughly 1 year on earth, which to his body makes him one year younger then the calender would say. The same goes for locke, who lost three years when he turned the wheel, so the locke we see in 2007, is really 3 years younger physically then his birthday says. So locke with ajira people is really only as old as he was in 2004. So if ben turned the wheel before keamy stormed the orchid it could explain why ben looks younger then 48-50. When ben got the mirror and crackers and signaled the orchid, he told hurley and locke that he hadn't been there for 12 years, which would have ben using the orchid or turning the wheel right around the purge..

i also think that charlotte's polar bear find in tunesia was interesting. I'm thinking that dharma trained the polar bears to turn the donkey wheel, while they were building the orchid, to test the donkey wheel and what exactly it did when turned, without having to sacrifice a human, hence all the training to get the bears smart enough for the task

2costa said...

a lot of peple have speculated that ben was lockes proxy on the plane because he was injured, or hurley proxy for just barely making the flight, but what if killing locke before the flight made Ben sawyer's proxy. After all sawyer had killed shrimp shack guy right before flight 815

i also wonder if richard knew that sawyer was gonna have to kill cooper for locke, if maybe , war earlier,they set up cooper to con young sawyers family, just to make sure sawyer had the proper motivation to carry out the deed later in life, and shrimp shack guy was just a warm up

Capcom said...

Good points about the bears 2costa. I wonder if the DI put homing beacons on them too, so that they could be located where ever the bears turned up on the earth, before they knew where the exits were? :o)

2costa said...

i like it capcom

Zort70 said...

2Costa - so it isn't a FDW it is a FPBW :-)

Interesting theory about the ages and all the time travel that is still to happen, I think that you are probably right that there is lots we haven't seen yet that will explain a lot of the wierdness we saw in the early episodes.

If Ben is on the island in 1974 then when Amy's baby is born that would make him between 15 to 17. He would definitely remember Sawyer, Juliet, Jin, etc. as I find uit hard to believe he would not encounter them at some point.

Hopefully that will be an episode some time soon. We could have the old time travel paradox debate. i.e. if you went back and killed Adolf Hitler would the world be a better place ?

Zort70 said...

The Lost Community Fantasy League Standings this week are :-

Detroit Blue Herons
Tsol
Elizabeth's Wicked LOST
DeD-LoSTieS
Lossa's Losties
Weagle Weagle War Eagle Fantasy Team
Team LuckyGuyLikeMe
maven
S.W.A.T.
You Don't Know Jack
Eight is Enough
They've all lostit
x-1
codysmom
Deceased-clown
UC is lost in time, space, and sanity
Bigdog
TheLostZort
Sayid's Army
8OrangeSmiles
greek-lost-team
Sterling
valerianmud
Memphish
FYSB's Fantasy Picks
Goatzilla
theVillage8
Team NO WORMHOLES
Sailormoon73's LFL

Zort70 said...

Sky 1 in the UK, who show Lost, have just launched a new Electronic Program Guide for their HD PVR to a limited number of people which has set the Forum on Digital Spy into overdrive.

I asked in the new EPR thread what we should call the new EPG and someone posted that it should be called Orchid, to which there a few other posts that were hinting that it had been called that by Sky internally.

So does that mean the new EPG will be able to time travel !

Sayid'sgirl said...

I keep dropping like a rock.
Hopefully I'll do better next week.

Sayid'sgirl said...

It looks like this week is the last week with enhanced versions of Lost.
The 8:00 slot has Scrubs and Better off Ted.
ABC had been promoting that Castle would be prmiered tonight at 8:00 but they premired it Sunday.
Now we get re runs of Scrubs.
One of the few things NBC did right was to cancel that show. JMO

memphish said...

Hey, I made a move up from the bottom this week in the league! I won't get too happy. At this point I'm kind of shooting for last. It's a realistic goal with my team apparently. :-)

As for Ethan. His last name is Rom, not Goodspeed. :-) I don't think he's Amy and Horace's baby, but given what we've already seen with Charlotte and her birthdate and her apparent age and her cover birthdate, I don't think we can rule out anyone we've met. It doesn't make sense for now that it would be Karl, but if he left the Island on the wrong heading it could be as an example.

In addition to the Olivia problem, I also have a huge problem with the date of the Purge being 1992. That date comes from the dead Horace who Locke talks to in a dream. I still don't think Danielle was on Island during the Purge. I think it predated 1988. Other than dream ghost Horace's date we have no confirmation of it, so just be careful when using that for your timelines.

Ellen said...

Memphish, I totally agree about the purge. I've always felt that "ghost" Horace's date was wrong. I think it happened earlier too. I'm going to have to go back and rewatch some of seasons 3 & 4 to get a better sense of when I thought it was. Seems like I came to the conclusion that it happened in the late 80's too...
xxoo

Capcom said...

I'm beginning to wonder why TPTB need to give us all this seemingly conflicting information for the past couple seasons. It also makes me think that if this show was actually told as a mystery story in a more conventional linear fashion, that it would not be as fascinating as it is in it's stilted and cryptic form. :-p

Or, maybe I'm just not in a very good mood today.

2costa said...

sorry my math was off ben was 28-30 during the purge and roughly 42 when flight 815 crashed

2costa said...

well mikhail and kelvins recruitment stories and dates seem to back up a 1990's purge, if danieele was on the island or not isn't really a good landmark in time for when the purge happened, couldn't she have had a gas mask like all the others or just been on a part of the island that wasn't affected. If the purge gas was island wide, why did ben use a personal can for his dad? perhaps ben saved danielle from the purge then stole her daughter? Ben saying he found danielle in a ditch seems to show she was being less then honest to sayid about never meeting any others besides whispers

Capcom said...

Danielle also might have missed out on the Purging fun if she happened to be safe in her underground bunker at the time. I don't have an opinion one way or the other about this, just sayin'.

Takes a Village said...

Happy Faux-Lost Day.
Congratulations to Detroit Blue Herons.Since my V-8 has only been running on 2 cylinders this season,
I feel like my team has fallen down a well, that has been filled in with dirt.The only way out is to turn the FDW.
Tonight I hope we'll find out about Horace, & Olivia, & Amy, & son.
That podcast joke about Lost being cancelled? Not funny...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bw4eLAlWyHo

memphish said...

Hey Melissa_Lossa and Lost2010 -- I finished Dark Tower today! The number of details present in the book, published in 2004, same year as 815 crashed, and LOST were too numerous to track, especially since they're mere details rather than integral plot points. I read it without taking any notes. 1000+ pages was enough on its own. Of course many have speculated that the ending will be the same. We'll see. I was satisfied with it, and frankly even though I should have seen it coming, I didn't.

But one thing from the book jumped out at me. Minor Dark Tower spoiler to follow. The Crimson King's man at his castle tells Roland that the Crimson King killed himself and is now Un-Dead and thus can't be killed. It did make me wonder if that's why Ben killed Locke, to prevent him from becoming Island Undead. Not that that worked.

lost2010 said...

Yay! Memphish! And now all those wonderful things i've been meaning to tell you about The Dark Tower have (naturally) fled my mind completely.

2costa said...

lostpedia says that both Horace and Olivia had wedding rings on in their first appearance. Assuming Ben was brought to the island roughly in 1973, that seems to prove Horace was in fact married to someone else other then Amy. Paul died in 1974, and i assume there was some courtship before Amy married horace. So i bet Olivia was either killed, got divorced, or left the island. If we see young ben in lefluer timeline it's a good bet that Horace was previously married, the only wrinkle in that is if Ben came to the island after lafleur surfaced within the three years in the seventies, but i doubt it because horace wasn't the head of security yet when he recruited roger linus. Although some think the enhancements are questionable, they also said Olivia was horace's wife. I tend to believe that, Olivia is supposed to play a major part in the grand scheme of lost from the season 3 dvd commentary , so i like to think the lost writers wouldn't just pull such a mulligan over casting issues. I bet Paul and Olivia will be involved in the future.

It Horace is a mathematician, why is he the head of security on the island?

lost2010 said...

Mathematician as in logistics maybe?

Capcom said...

Maybe Horace was sort of the Scout Master of the Barracks. :-)

Ellen said...

For those of you who are not averse to spoilers...
l
o
o
k

h
e
r
e

*
*
*
*
*
*
**
**
**
**
**
**
Kristin @ EOnline

I don't know how accurate this info is (Kristin has been mistaken before) but I think she might be right....:(

memphish said...

So nobody watched the pop-ups huh? Guess we better hope someone with Lostpedia editing desire did. Only 1 week 'til new LOST!

Zort70 said...

It's odd being here on a Thursday at the moment !

Zort70 said...

Even odder, not to see large amounts of comments about a new episode.

lost2010 said...

Watched Castle last night instead. . .liked it. Sort of similar to Bones if anyone else likes that.

bigdog said...

I watched some of the popups last night. one that i did see was the Horace was the head of the DI at that time. not just head of security.

and Ellen whenerver i watch E and kristin comes on with something about LOSt i put my fingers in my ears and start singing. i was spoiled once by her.

lost2010 said...

ellen - I think I happened upon that one this morning. It was the sort of spoiler that I tend to like - more hinty and make you guessy than give the show away. . .that said, it's definitely a spoiler.

Of course, I'm sad that she said it bleep not bleep bleep bleep not bleep bleep bleep bleep bleep.

ahem, now back to the regular programming.

Ellen said...

*lol* Lost2010! I know what you mean! xxoo

lost2010 said...

LOL! ;)

Ellen said...

bigdog - that's why I put the spoiler alert! She's spoiled me on occasion too, when I didn't want to be spoiled. I'm kind of a fence-sitter when it comes to spoilers. I don't want any major spoilers, but previews, promos, sneak peeks (sometimes)are ok to me.
xxoo

maven said...

It's almost spooky around her on a Thursday morning. There are some scary spoiler teasers in some headlines on TVGuide and EW....be careful. I haven't seen it myself.

On a personal note and one reason I'm thankful there isn't a new episode this week: My Mother took a turn for the worse yesterday and might only have a day or two left. She developed pneumonia after her move to her new nursing home and my sister and I decided to not take any heroic measures. We are keeping vigil now.

Capcom said...

Dangitt, Castle was on last night??!! That makes two times now that it wasn't in my local TV guide! :-p Only caught about the last 10 minutes of the first run of the preview by accident. I'll tell ya, could Kevin Dillon get any cuter? Sure wish that he was a regular on Lost. :-x

Ahem, back to topic, I watched the popups last night and it said that Horace was the leader of the DHARMA Initiative on the island. There were a few other interesting quips that are worth checking out on Lostpedia that I can't remember, sorry. But most of it was obvious info for us.

Capcom said...

Aw, prayers for your mother Maven. xxxxoooo

Capcom said...

BTW, very disappointed that Shannon Dougherty will be on Lost...j/k. That's what first thought when I scrolled down the linked article Ellen. :o)

memphish said...

Maven, Sorry to hear your news. Praying for you and your family.

Capcom said...

Hey Lost2010, why did you delete your Lost blog?! :-o

Ellen said...

Maven - my prayers are with you and your family...
xxoo

lost2010 said...

capcom - couldn't keep up with both my blogger addiction and my facebook addiction. Facebook won. :)

lost2010 said...

Hey, maybe. . . that means we'll get. . .

a bleep bleep bleep bleep with bleep bleeping bleep bleep bleep bleep.

I bet bleep and bleep could really show off with that.

lost2010 said...

maven - you're still in my thoughts.

Zort70 said...

Maven - Sorry to hear the news, we'll be thinking of you.

Capcom said...

Wow, I'm sorry to hear that Lost2010, I don't do FB and probably won't for a while. I'll miss your blog. :-(

lost2010 said...

capcom - That's nice of you to say. I'll still be following your blog though!

bigdog said...

Maven, my thought and prayers to you and your family.

Dark Angel said...

Hi Guys,

Loooong time, no see :)

A lot seems to have happened to keep me busy since I was last here (I have a daughter now for starters!)

Anyay just thought I'd let you know that David asked me if I wanted to be on the Podcast this week and all going well (and Skype working) I'll be on the podcast.

Good to see all the familiar faces here

DA :)

Sayid'sgirl said...

maven
I'm sorry to hear about your mother.

lost2010
To bad about your blog. I enjoyed it.

Sayid'sgirl said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Sayid'sgirl said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Sayid'sgirl said...

Hey Dark Angel!
Good to see you. Congrats on the birth of your daughter.
Hope to see you around more often.

Capcom said...

Ncie to see you Dark Angel and congrats! I was thinking about you the other day.

Takes a Village said...

Maven,I will also be praying for your Mother, and family.Thanks for letting us know.
Dark Angel Daddy; Welcome back.Congratulations on your Daughters arrival.Great to hear about the podcast.

Amused2bHere said...

aw Maven...many prayers for you and your family...especially your mom.

{{{big hug arms around Maven!}}}

lost2010 said...

This is pretty cute:

Fan art

Twinkle said...

Dark Angel!!!!

Hang on about Ben's timeline. I'm sure TPTB have it figured out and it all works. Several people have proposed timelines that work.

2Costa: Interesting theories as always. Dharma didn't have access to the donkey wheel. they sealed up the wall, went no further, and built the chamber in front of it, the same chamber Ben had to explode in order to have access to the donkey wheel. All of this begs the question about how a Dharma polar bear could get to Tunisia without the FDW.

Also, regarding the Tunisia exit and Ben's visit to the hotel, I didn't see anything about Ben having been there just two weeks earlier and Lostpedia doesn't have a reference to that either. Where did that come from? It could be that Ben will make another trip to Tunisia in the future which will take him back before the time we saw him appear there in 2005.

Twinkle said...

Oh, and I read the Kristin thing. My reaction was, "Darn! That would have solved so much if bleep had bleeped."

maven said...

Thanks for everyone's kind wishes....Mom left us peacefully today....

Twinkle said...

Oh, Maven! God bless you and yours!

Capcom said...

Aw Maven, our condolences to your family. xo

maven said...

Thanks for the card, Capcom....and everyone's kinds thoughts at this time.

Zort70 said...

Peace and Love to you and yours Maven

ib4uc said...

maven... so sorry to hear about your loss. You're in my thoughts and prayers.

bigdog said...

Maven, Condolences to you & your family.

Sayid'sgirl said...

maven
Sorry for your loss.
Condolences to you and your family.

memphish said...

Maven, my heart goes out to you and your family.

Amused2bHere said...

Maven, sincere condolences on loss of your beloved mom. My family's prayers are with you and yours.

2costa said...

thanks twinkle, i can't remember if the hotel clerk mentioned it or someone did a screencap of the sign in book, but i remember at the time i thought it showed ben's window of oppurtunity to kill nadia, before he returned to tunesia two weeks later

2costa said...

to go with the question of burial on the island, i think its interesting that the others did that vikingesque burial at sea for colleen

Zort70 said...

Almost forgot to say hi and welcome back to Dark Angel.

Good to have another Brit amongst us.

Capcom said...

I've often wondered what the momentary insert of Viking tradition was supposed to mean in the story as well 2costa. :-o

2costa said...

NARJISS: Good afternoon, sir.

BEN: Good afternoon. I'd like a room, please.

NARJISS: Of course, sir. Is this your first time in Tunisia?

BEN: No, but it's been a while.

NARJISS: Your name?

BEN: I'm actually a preferred guest. It should be under "Dean Moriarty".

[Ben hands her a passport. She looks through the register, then up at him in a bit of shock.]

NARJISS: Certainly, Mr. Moriarty.

[She gets him a key.]

NARJISS: May I help you with anything else?

BEN: Yes. Um, today's date is...

NARJISS: October 24th, sir.

BEN: (Embarrassedly) 2005?

NARJISS: Yes, sir. 2005.

[He shakes his head--"silly me"--and turns away.]

BEN: Thank you. \


i think that there's a screencap out there that has moriarty in the registry, being a preffered guest shows he's been there before or at least his alias has. I might be wrong about the two weeks thing, but ben admits he's been there before. it's been a while might refer to 12 years earlier Ben was at the orchid.

I think that the orchid when it was running couldn't transport you to any place or time, but probably all or some of the vortices locations, one of which being the desert location

Zort70 said...

The thing is with time travel that Ben could have gone to the hotel, like we have seen on the show, and then in the future gone to the hotel before he first got there and booked himself in for the future.

Then gone back to the past or got a message to the past to tell him that when he first goes to Tunisia he will be staying in that hotel under that name.

Sorry if that is a little confusing, but time travel within your own personal timeline can be awkward to explain.

Zort70 said...

So he travels from the island to Tunisia in 2005, then goes back to the island in 2008, travels at some point back to before 2005 and makes all the arrangements. Then travels to before we first meet him in 2004 to give himself a message about the hotel.

Melissa_Lossa said...

maven - sorry to hear your sad news.

Falcon said...

And that is why I was so glad the last episode was time travel-lite. Ole four toes and then we were immersed in Dharma Days.

I read a spoiler or two this morning, guys - this is about to get really - really good.

Melissa_Lossa said...

memphish - I'm so happy you liked the end of Dark Tower! I really did, too. When the whole time travel story started on Lost with Desmond, I wondered if they might go for a similar scenario.

Nice point about the Crimson King, too! I wondered if dying and then going back to the island made you immortal there, somehow. But maybe it can only happen once? That would explain why Widmore wanted Locke alive, and why Ben and Widmore can't kill each other. Maybe when Ben heard that Widmore was using Locke to get to Hawking, he killed him to ruin Widmore's chances, but in doing so, sacrificed his own chance?

Falcon said...

Sigh - Falcon = Lost2010 - hate when I do that.

Capcom said...

Gasp! You looked at spoilers Lost2010??!! Ahem, where was it at? *heheh* :o)

Falcon said...

capcom - well see, it started on youtube. . .on-set interviews. . .so they were pretty careful about what they revealed but it was tantalizing. . .

Takes a Village said...

Maven,sincere condolences to you,your family, and to all those who loved,and will miss your Mom.

bigdog said...

just watched cost of living tonight. IMO that was a very good episode. I forgot how good Mr.Eko was. i will always wonder if he would have had a greater importance to the show had he not wanted out. Like what would have happened had he confessed? It was also Juliets first act of defecting from Ben and the others. all and all pretty good stuff.

I cant wait to find out how they let us behind the curtain on smokey. back then it was a lot more spiritual to me. with time travel in place i have a feeling it will be more sci -fi.

BarbaraJay said...

I'm so sorry for your loss, Maven.

Ellen said...

Deepest condelences, Maven. You and your family are in my prayers...xxoo

Capcom said...

FWIW, I've done a (very) little research on floating islands that I just put on my Lost Science blog. I included the article and link on the Alcatraz theory that someone posted here during one of the ARGs. I can't remember who it is, so if you are still here and know I'm talking about you, let me know so I can give you credit. :-)

If I (or anyone) can find any more information on the possibility of floating islands, I'll update it.

http://perditascientia.blogspot.com

LostIt said...

So sorry for your loss, Maven. Big hugs. (((Maven)))

Passafist said...

If anyone is around Steve and I are broadcasting Live! @ talkshoe.com at 3pm. We already started the podcast but when we realized that thanks to daylight savings time we were an hour early for Dark Angel we decided to regroup and start again at 3pm EST! Come on over and listen in..

Zort70 said...

Sorry I missed the announcement, it would have been good to be part of the show.

I hope it was a good one.

Black Swan said...

So sorry to hear about your Mom, Maven. My thoughts and prayers are with you.

memphish said...

Get your own Faraday bag.

maven said...

Thanks to everyone for their kind words and support. We had a wonderful service and I am at peace. I feel I loss my "real" mother many years ago as she declined, so I have been in mourning all this time.

Now onto Wednesday and a new LOST!

2costa said...

someone had an interesting theory i read, i stole a couple points from it. Basically it explains alot of what weve seen through avoiding time paradoxes. When daniel first had eloise mentally travel through time with the numbers desmond brought him, the reason she knew the maze after the shot of the ray was daniel already "INTENDED" on teaching it to her. In order for dan to avoid a time paradox he would have had to have taught her the maze after the test, the catch is she died before he could teach it to her, which avoided the paradox becasue it is a one way process, meaning eloise travelled to the future, a future that actually would never arrive, since she died. This kind of paradox would be no big deal, since it could just be swept under the rug of the space time continum, but had dan meddled with something in the past, the paradox could be dire. This is often referred to as the grandfather paradox, in short meaning you can't go back in time and kill your grandfather, before your father is born anyway, because you would never exist in the future, yes like mike j fox dissappearing in the picture in back to the future. It's grandfather paradox and not father, because i guess you could technically go back in time and kill your father after you were born and still exist, but i digress.

The important part of last paragraph was INTENTION. If you intend to do something especially on the island, the paradox police start to get nervous. Perhaps the reason locke could walk again when he came to the island, is tied to cooper's death. After sawyer killed cooper he asked locke is it true he threw you out of a window and put you into a wheelchair, locke's response"not anymore". Although this could be seen as him saying he could walk again, but what if, richard brought cooper to ben from an earlier time before he threw locke out the window, then killing him would instantly change lockes past and explain why he could walk again. "not Nymore" almost seems like he's saying that now that never happened, because in mainland reality he was never thrown from the window. I think it's all Ben's and richard's INTENTIONS, if they always knew he was gonna have locke/sawyer kill cooper then the second locke hit the beach he could walk because that will all play out. Another example when locke INTENDED to climb up to yemmi's plane, his legs started giving out on him. Thats the old paradox patrol, had locke gone up in the plane instead of boone he never could have sent the island flashing and sent lafluer and co back in time, and he probably couldn't have gotten to the point where they killed cooper before any of that happened and thus restored his legs, his legs where just signaling to him because once he had the INTENTION to climb up things started getting ready to change, thus get killed in plane never kill cooper and never get unparalyzed. Just as he couldn't bring himself to shoot widmore.

This all brings me to the way locke is alive on the island with the ajira people. Perhaps Ben had to kill locke in order for him to be alive on the island upon his return. If lafluer or anybody in the past with knowledge of the future were to kill Ben before he has a chance to kill locke in the real world then locke's death is negated, no ben then nobody killed locke. And all they would have to do is INTEND on doing it for it to start to change things. So in a way lockes recurring leg problems are a version of marty mcfly's fading polaroid. Had locke killed himself he wouldn't have been alive upon returning to the island because there is no way to kill locke in the past to stop him from killing himself, if thats not paradoxy enough for you. The power of the island is letting people that are products of paradoxical past exist in the new reality with memories of the paradox. Richard and Ben probably hatched the plan with locke dying and specifically ben killing him to exploit a loophole in the space time contiuum so that locke would be alive in 2007. So basically someone had to kill locke that was on the island during one of the time flash periods like amy or Ben, someone that was always on the island in say 1977 donkey wheel or not. So in turn an 815'er, a freighty, or julliette could kill that person in the past before they killed locke and presto you have alive locke in 2007 And all the paradoxes you created by killing that person(ben) could get swept under the rug like eloise never learning the maze that mastering caused her to croak.

Sayid'sgirl said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Sayid'sgirl said...

Spoiler Alert
























I just heard on the news that Lost plans 2 deaths this season. One a major character one not.
I just know it's going to be Sayid. I've felt it since I watched the early promos before the new season. boo hoo.
I hope I'm wrong.












END SPOILER ALERT

Zort70 said...

2Costa Said... swept under the rug of the space time continum

That is going to be one lumpy rug at the end of the series !

Sayid'sgirl said...

HAPPY SAINT PATRICK'S DAY

lol zort

Zort70 said...

Yes top of the morning to all the Irish folk reading.

Melissa_Lossa said...

Sayid's Girl - I saw that as well, and I concur.

lost2010 said...

SG - Maybe, maybe not. You never can tell.

Zort70 said...

Just because someone is ****** it doesn't mean they will not be ** *** ****

(was that cryptic enough ?)

Sayid'sgirl said...

lol I think it was a little to cryptic. At least for me anyway.

I think I might be following your line of thought though, if not the precise words.

Capcom said...

XO Maven.

The buzz about that spoiler does sound like that doesn't it Sayidsgirl.

Happy St. Patrick's Day everyone! Can anyone figure out how to make a shamrock emoticon? :o)

Capcom said...

BTW, thanks for the Faraday bag link Memphish! I just might get one.

Zort70 said...

Capcom, how about :

%%-

maven said...

Happy St. Patrick's Day to all those who are Irish today! And....Happy LOST Eve!

Twinkle said...

There's an article on SciFiWire today that's spoilerish. http://scifiwire.com/2009/03/young-ben-gives-up-a-few.php

What's not spoilerish and really sweet is that the actor that played young Ben and the actor that played young Annie are "close friends." Awww!

Sayid'sgirl said...

capcom
I haven't heard any buzz,just what was said on my local news.
So who knows,buzz has been wrong before. :)

Capcom said...

LOL Zort!

Well, I had peeked at some comments on the above spoiler at a blog Sayidsgirl, and the speculation votes were in that favor. :-O But who knows? They could be wrong, we usually are when we try to second-guess TPTB.

Ditto, awwwww, Twinnkle!

Melissa_Lossa said...

Thanks, Twinkle! I posted the Sci Fi Wire interview over at link

Melissa_Lossa said...

And by "link," I mean Spoiler Fixed.

Capcom said...

Hey LoCos, Ms.Wendy says on her blog that a Geronimo Jackson single is available on I-Tunes for a while for free!

http://mswendy.wordpress.com/

Sayid'sgirl said...

capcom
I seen that on DarkUFO.
Dharma Lady is typical early 70's.
I like it of course.
Cause I'm typical early 70's. :)

TLC said...

The new podcast is ready!! I put a little clip of the Geronimo Jackson song at the beginning!!!

WORD UP!

2costa said...

Geronimo Jackson is a 1970s band from San Francisco, California. Little is known about the group, but references to the band have been made on Lost starting in Season 2. The only named member of the band, Keith Strutter, as well as several other band members, have "kind of gone missing" according to Damon Lindelof.


On Lost

* Charlie and Hurley found the Geronimo Jackson album Magna Carta in the Swan's collection of LPs. Charlie, as "an expert in all things musical”, said that he had never heard of them. (Neither had Sayid.) ("The Hunting Party") Locke later noticed the Magna Carta record while flipping through various albums. ("The Whole Truth")
* Undercover police officer Eddie wore a T-shirt with the Magna Carta album cover picture silkscreened on the front. He claimed it to be one of his "dad's old shirts". Commune leader Mike remarked that Eddie's dad had "excellent taste". ("Further Instructions")
* A Geronimo Jackson poster adorned the inside door of the locker that 16-year old John Locke was locked in. ("Cabin Fever")
* A Geronimo Jackson vinyl cover is seen next to a DJ at Hurley's surprise birthday party. ("There's No Place Like Home, Part 1")
* Charlotte says 'Turn it up! I love Geronimo Jackson!' to the group during a flash. ("This Place Is Death")
* Jin is listening to "Dharma Lady" by Geronimo Jackson in his DHARMA van right before he runs into Jack, Kate and Hurley who have just crashed from flight 316. ("316")
* Rosie is seen wearing a Geronimo Jackson shirt when dancing with Jerry. ("LaFleur")


are we supposed to think that geranimo jacksom disappeared to the island?

if they are so obscure why are there albums showing up on the show so much, is it basically like seeing the numbers. Interesting that the narc in locke's weed cult claimed his geranimo jackson shirt was his dads. To go with their song having a dharma reference, it's interesting dj dn said strutters first band was the karma imperative.

Does anyone think Strutter may have had a hand in designing the looking glass station?

Takes a Village said...

Nice info and thoughts about Geronimo Jackson.They have been mentioned almost as much as Drive Shaft.
I hope you all have had a great St.Patrick's Day.

Capcom said...

I'm not sure what we are supposed to think about GJ, 2costa. Maybe they were a bunch of Dharma-ites who managed to get an indy label to make a record for them, and they were known mostly only to the DI?

I've always wondered about those hippies maybe knowing the DI somehow.

Capcom said...

Hey, I was just thinking of Mittlewerk and how he might fit into this season, if TPTB want those of us hardcore fans who did play the game to consider him. But they probably don't.

Anyway, the show has now surpassed the time when Mittlewerk tried to do his dirty work at the end of TLE, so I guess that he wasn't any more successful in his plans than the DI was. [[snicker]]

2costa said...

i still wanna know wat the valanzetti equation had to do with the virus mittlewerk was planning to let loose?

Capcom said...

Yeah, I don't know if we will ever get told the details of that. *sniff* Unless if/when we are told about what exactly the incident was, that would be a good time for TPTB to bring the VE up. :o)

Capcom said...

Oh, but as for what the VE had to do with the virus plans, wasn't that so Mittlejerk could eliminate the 30% of the population that was supposed to be the solution for the VE doomsday forcast?

memphish said...

Happy LOST Day!

Sayid'sgirl said...

HAPPY LOST DAY!!!

memphish said...

I dreamed last night that Rose and Bernard were Hostiles, but that they were communicating with the Dharma Losties.

Sayid'sgirl said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Sayid'sgirl said...

You know you've waited to long for Lost when you start having dreams about it without a new episode. ;)

Melissa_Lossa said...

Happy Lost Day!

NEW POST!