Locke's motives become clear.
Yes, that's all we get. Call him Flocke, call him the Locke Monster - apparently tonight he's laying all his cards on the table.
There aren't even any promotional photos, so I'm cross-promoting the Live event happening next Thursday. Click on the image to check it out - everybody got your tickets? If not, here's the skinny:
New York Times entertainment editor Lorne Manly will have an in-depth conversation with executive producer Carlton Cuse and co-creator/executive producer Damon Lindelof on the challenges of crafting a finale that satisfies themselves as storytellers, and the show’s legion of fans. They will be accepting questions from the fans ahead of time - again, click the image to find out how to submit yours!
Tuesday, May 11, 2010
Across the Sea - Season 6, Episode 14
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So who else is going next Thursday?
Are you going Melissa? I'm not to far away to costly. And not able to get away.
I'm going with Scoutpost and she's staying over at my house! :)
^^^^That's for Lost Live. I'm also going to the Movie theater thing on the 20th!
Have fun East Coasters!
Hi ya'll! Happy Lost Day...ready!
xxoo
OMG i want to go to that SO BAD
In answer to your FB question 2C, I'm here! :-D
I have a guess- MIB's mother-
I have nooo idea what is going on.
Is this the birth of Romulus and Remus? I mean, Jacob and MIB? Heheh.
good guess JT youre probably right!
I'm here! Thought that was Kate on Michael's raft at first!
Good call JT
lol REally?!
MIB is dressed in black from birth!
Wow...
And no name!
Bad Twin anyone?
Cool... there will be one near me... i'm going!!!!
OH no- just like Aaron with Kate- who's going to feed the babies?
Oh I had a bad feeling about that situation. I love Alison Jenny. Don't think I spelled her name right, but you know who I mean.
Jacob & baby in black?
Ooh, capcom - I like that! Romulus and Remus!
And yes, I am going to the theater event. Can't wait! Anyone in Michigan want to go? ha!
Yay, more grotesque murderous killing in season 6! :-p
Sooo, MIB thinks his mother was wacky, but it wasn't really his mother?
WTH? Why did she hit her with a rock?
LOL TAV, BIB! X-D
TAV- BIB
BabyInLocke?
Capcom- you beat me to it!
Yep, bad twin indeed SG.
To solve the feeding issue, maybe the woman lost a baby recently but still produces milk so she can feed them?
Is she weaving a tapestry?
Yeah, maybe a wet-nurse, as the term used to be.
Is young Jacob the jungle kid?
I think so.
Someone, maybe at Eye M Sick or here, guessed that the island was MIB's home. Touche'
Donkey Wheel?
What is the light do you suppose?
I'm loving it! This is amazing.
Guys...where are we?
Crazy stuff... yes, I think Jacob is the young kid in the jungle... so, I'm wondering if the "light" is the good in all men, ala Dogen's speech to Sayid
hahahaha baby in black
This is weird!
Is she Tawaret?
Are there leprechauns down there?!
LOL Capcom, I was thinking "Pot of gold" too!
Like Jacob to John- I'm sorry- then the rock.
lol capcom
Maybe it's Love.
Am I watching Lost?
what young kid in the jungle are you guys talking about? Isnt it obvious that Jacob is in White and BIB is in black? im confused.
Boy she really hates men. They're playing Senet.
wuh oh.
what is Senet?
Like seeing the Barracks!
And crazy lady living alone- Rousseau & Claire.
Jacob and Jack have a lot of the same hang-ups
Kat- the boy in the jungle is from a couple of eps ago (title escapes me) - where the boy reminds Flocke that "you can't kill him"
King Tut played senet
That's it SG! Love. Scourge of the earth, to a lonely cwazy old bat.
The kid in the jungle Locke saw.
Are we halfway through already? This is pretty great.
Senet is an ancient Egyptain game that they think backgammon came from.
I really thought their dead mom's ghost was going to turn into Smokey and claim "kid in black"
So MIB's home really is across the sea somewhere -Romans maybe?
Oh oh yeah!!1 the kid in the jungle i remember now. wow all grown up...
Right Ginger! :-D
Shades of Eko.
Hmmmm, could the golden light be the same light that is in the middle of the FDW that Ben turned?
And maybe Smokey is just a zillion magnetic metal filings that MIB learned to manipulate. :-p
Capcom, yeah I think so
that scene was so much like the swan construction site
so many parallels.. just same things happening over and over
Capcom - exactly!
Wow CRAZY OLD BAT. he cant die... i hope he kills her.
No wonder MIB has issues.
I love you ((hug)) now I kill you!
Oh, dear.
Sign me up for Team Smokey.
Whoa!
LOL, TAV
I like MIB better than Jacob
Good Call Capcom.. its Definitely the wheel
I wonder how the heck he figured taht harnessing the light and turning the wheel would allow him to leave the island. That's a huge stretch. A leap of faith, maybe?
He's special???
I cant believe she did that I hope he kills her.... seriously.
@LostIt, maybe they dropped something into the light and it disappeared?
I guess because he is 'special'
earlier when seeing the vision of his real mom:
Why can't Jacob see you? (to the vision of the real mother)
because I'm dead
Another of his special abilities that Jacob doesn't have?
Yeah I thought is was the donkey wheel when I first seen the light. But I guess it's actually the energy. They haven't put the wheel in place to harness it yet.
I'm betting he does kill her and that's why Jacob sees him as evil incarnate.
Capcom- i think so too, and if turning the wheel lets out a little bit of light, perhaps in addition to the flashes/time travel, that's why its a measure of last resort... it lets the light out and depletes the source? So there will be no light anywhere...
OK, so now we find out how Smokey comes to be.
he seems mad... lol
Come on I want to know how he turns into smoke!
Im ready to find out... lets go commercials... after 6 years i think were all ready haha
Okay, so if you need to drink the wine to be a candidate, how was Jacob going to replace himself after MiB broke the bottle?
Yeah it is a little of a stretch that they figured a way to harness the energy, etc....
Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned.
Very nice TOL.
Did MIB figure out how to harness it or "his" people?
Neat idea, TOL!
Yeah, I gotta agree with y'all, Old Bat must die. :-o
AL- maybe its not drink to become a candidate, but the final candidate gets a drink (even so, where will it come from as you ask)
Does it mean anything that Jacob gave Richard wine first thing?
It's probably just ritual, not really a requirement.
@Ginger, I dunno, it seemed pretty important.
Oh, nice JT forgot all about that.
Well, there ya go... ouch. Stabbed in the back no less.
Did she just thank him? Did I hear that right?
NO way... he's taking him to his fate worse than death!
Oh ok. Worst than death.
They're both victims of crazy mama.
Adam and EVe!!
MIB and the mom are adam and eve
I think so.. I think Richard protected it after jacob.
Wow, I feel so happy that Adam and Eve weren't anyone that we knew!
Well I guess that does prove this is where they were going all along like they said.
Thank you...
That was beyond awesome.
My head hurts. So what is that THING that was using MiB's body?
Wow. They did that Adam and Evein a really cool way. But, what now, have we really learned crucial to the big picture!
Re: back to drinking the wine- usually its a symbol of a covenant/agreement--- i'd go more with only the final candidate who takes the job having to drink.. ala mom "now we're the same"
Didn't Jacob give RA the wine after he said he wanted to live forever? Or, not die. I can't remember. If so, then the answer to RA's request was the elixer of life.
I liked this episode alot.
Why still no name?
Why just brother?
Hubby wants to know whay mother never aged- not really much older at the end?
There was no bet between Jacob & brother in the end.
Did the crazy not-real adoptive mother go down the light hole too when she died?
Maybe she drank the wine too. So if you drink the wine you can't kill yourself? Someone else has to kill ya? I dunno.
I'm confused now... have to watch that again. They still leave so much unanswered..
I don't think the THING was using MIB's body. That's what MIB became after going into the stream of light. MIB doesn't have a body anymore he's smoke. I think the smoke took the likeness of MIB's body with Richard.
"Every question I answer will lead to more questions"
@SG, yeah, I get that, but how come he didn't always take MiB's likeness? Why did he have to switch?
JT
lol That's what she said wasn't it. :)
I was just thinking that myself JT.
I saw the title to this ep was "Across the Sea"- and I thought it would be a waste of time with Shannon-glad that didn't happen!
Oh, wait, okay, I think I get it. Smokey can take the form of anyone dead on the island, until he gets stuck in locke.
So she said "Thank you" when MIB killed her. Maybe she was tired of her role and her only release was for someone else to kill her? Maybe that's why Jacob didn't fight Ben when he killed him - he knew it would happen and was relieved to be released?
Based upon the existence of the Adam skeleton, it seems to me that Jacob's brother is dead and the Smoke Monster has been using his image, just as he later used dead Locke's image. The Smoke Monster itself is the bad guy, rather than "Man in Black / Jacob's brother" being the bad guy as we thought throughout the sixth season. Jacob's brother is gone - dead is dead.
i need to rewatch this too... i feel like there is still way to much that is unanswered
Okay, so Jacob's the first one we've seen with Mommy issues, rather than Daddy!
Oh- I think smokey is still the essence of MIB
I was thinking of the La Mer thing too JT. :-)
No way, Kate had mommy issues too, IMO. And Jack's mom was a lush. And Locke's mom was kookooforcocoapuffs.
Very good Olessi.
There not trying to keep MIB or Locke on the island, they're trying to keep the smoke monster on the island. So it doesn't spread evil.
Inane thought towards the end of the episode: Evangeline Lilly was really hot six years ago.
JT- perhaps its all the realization that MIB had about the evil of the people he really came from... that's what the island turned into smoke...
Jacob is still naive- maybe not as enlightened as we thought- or maybe more so???
it was great to see Adam and Eve and know that MIB and Jacob are bros (Jacob and Easu?)--- but again, I'm with those who are asking, what really more do we know that is key?
There is something about the island to protect, so that is true.
MiB was originally thought to be the candidate as he was special (with Hurley type powers)
They all look so young from Season 1 like babies. I noticed that in my re watch this summer.
The well with the wheel was destroyed. Someone eventually built it. I wonder if MIB/smokey coached others who came to the island on what to do?
It seemed like the wine gave Jacob some kind of knowledge as well a sealing him as the protector. Probably gave him agelessness too?
I thought Jacob gave Richard the wine before the whole not dying conversation. So did jacob make him ageless even before he asked for it?
Sigh... I'd like to NOT think that I age noticably in 6 years.... perhaps I'd like to stay a little naive too! ;-)
good night all!
lol Me too TOL.
Night.
LOL Amy, if they didn't resuse old footage, I was thinking that they let her be all nice and pretty and freshly-crashed in that scene to make it look like a previous taping.
I don't know JT, my addled brain thinks that Jacob gave RA the wine after he said, "That...I can do", after he beat the crap outta him. I'll have to go back and check.
Well- we found out that MIB and Jacob did not start out as "aliens" or anything like that. What made MIB special though and Jacob not?
The West Coasters are in for a treat.
Bad Twin, R.I.P.
TAV is going to R.I.P. now too.
Goodnight Loco's.
G'nite TAV! Thanks for the laffs, as usual! :-D
good-night, TAV
LostIt said...
So she said "Thank you" when MIB killed her. Maybe she was tired of her role and her only release was for someone else to kill her? Maybe that's why Jacob didn't fight Ben when he killed him - he knew it would happen and was relieved to be released?
I got that feeling too.
Olessi said...
Based upon the existence of the Adam skeleton, it seems to me that Jacob's brother is dead and the Smoke Monster has been using his image, just as he later used dead Locke's image. The Smoke Monster itself is the bad guy, rather than "Man in Black / Jacob's brother" being the bad guy as we thought throughout the sixth season. Jacob's brother is gone - dead is dead.
I love this idea
Night TAV.
It seems the one's deemed special aren't necessarily the leaders.
So we're still left with the question - Is Smokey as we know him in present day really what's left of MIB or is it some other entity that impersonated the dead MIB?
Capcom- checked LP transcript-& Jacob gave Richard the wine first as he explained the cork in the bottle.
Mother says that going into the light is "rebirth" and "worse than dying"- so I guess Smokey could be that rebirth.
OK, someone clarify this for me though. The scene on the beach in The Incident happens after MiB's death, right? So, Jacob knows that Smokey, in the body of his dead brother, wants to kill him to get off the island? If Smokey wants to go home, he must be MiB.
I don't know if has been said but MIB killed his "mother" before she could say anything. Do you think she was claimed?
Awesome episode. Going to the theater event on May 20th here in Fort Worth. I have to go home now where I have no internet & am poor :( Read ya later LoCos!
Ohhh, nice catch Blacky on why Jacob might have wanted to die!
Right, Lostit, is Smokey just the badass consciousness of MIB still having the impetus to go out into the world and kick some butt?
And Flocke says that Jacob- "took his humanity"-so that sounds like MIB is still in there.
Hubby wants to know who made the rules that they follow now. Jacob's brother says that when it's his game he can make the rules- is that what has happened?
Lostit
I said earlier that it's what MIB became when he went into the light. But it could be that for some reason MIB released the smoke when he went into the light.
Either way Smokey impersonates dead people including MIB.
JT, first before what, explaining the bottle/island, or asking RA what he wished for? Tx. It's only important if he gave RA the wine after RA said what he wanted. Then we would know for sure that the wine gave RA his extended life properties. Kinda. :->
As much as I liked this episode, I still think the order of this season could have been much better if it had gone:
Ab Aeterno
Across the Sea
LA X...
JT
It sounds like Jacob has made his own rules.
He gave Richard the wine first thing before the conversation about what Richard wanted. I thought that Jacob might have snuck the wine in and made Richard ageless before he asked for it.
Capcom
Jacob gave RA the wine before RA asked to live forever.
I'd have to agree Amy. We got too long of a stretch of killing, running, arguing, (repeat many times) across the island, and it would have been nice to get this one a week or two ago. But I guess TPTB didn't want to reveal it yet. :-p
Amy Lynn
That would have given us answers sooner. But we would have lost the suspence/
Tx SG and JT. So then it does look like Jacob snuck the wine/elixer in before asking then? Meanie!
I'm still confused about the kid in the jungle that FLocke saw. We know MIB can see dead people, so is he seeing Jacob's ghost? Why is Jacob appearing as a kid?
OK- I'm off-will have to jot down anything that pops up! Nite all!
And why could Sawyer and Desmond see him but Richard couldn't?
I don't think it would have lost the suspense, actually. I think if we had gotten the (truly fascinating) mythology stuff out of the way earlier, it would have been easier for us to accept and focus on the Flash Sideways, instead of the constant "what's the island, who is Smokey" rhetoric that we've had to juggle with the FS storylines.
lol That's the difference between you and me. I don't want to focus on the FS. Even if we got the mythology first.
I enjoy the constant island rhetoric it's my favorite part.
The only other thing I wasn't sure the episode needed was the S1 flashback. Are there THAT many viewers who wouldn't get that Crazy Lady/MiB were Adam/Eve that we had to be spoon fed?
On a different note, the kids were wonderful. My SO couldn't get over how well they matched the adult actors.
The Jacob and Esau Biblical parallel is making much more sense now.
Esau (MiB) was supposed to be the rightful heir to his father Isaac, but Jacob ended up taking it instead. The circumstances are different, but it makes perfect sense in the context of the plot.
Amy Lynn
Yeah I'd say there are some who wouldn't remember Adam and Eve.
Night JT.
@Chris - I SO agree with you...I've always thought of them as Jacob and Esau! The parallel makes so much sense...
xxoo
LostIt said...
I'm still confused about the kid in the jungle that FLocke saw. We know MIB can see dead people, so is he seeing Jacob's ghost? Why is Jacob appearing as a kid?
It seems that they showed us the kid in the jungle so we'd know who we were seeing tonight? I have no idea why Sawyer and Desmond see him but Richard couldn't... my only thought being that Richard was an Other? One of those awful people 'Mother' warned the boys about. LOL, I have NO IDEA!!! more confused than ever at the moment. :P
LOL Amy, and you can bet that in the popups there will be...."These are the two dead people that Kate and Jack found with the stones in episode....".
Ginamarie at Eye M Sick asked a good question...at this point it looks like MIB never got off the island, so what was all that talk about "I used to have life, love, and junk..." Unless he was just talking about his short stint with the visiting humans before they got burned up. That must be it.
The jungle boy is getting older. Desmond is special maybe Sawyer is too. MIB seemed surprised that Sawyer could see jungle boy Jacob.
BTW I wonder why Adam and Eve's clothing was still intact and Jack guessed was around 40 years old? Time travel maybe?
Interesting point, Capcom.
There's a bit of Cain and Abel in tonight's ep, too.
How about this? They need to bury the skeletons! Jacob didn't bury his 'mother' or brother!! They are still there in the caves, just skeletons now. Jacob couldn't let go! And now they're all paying for it! He keeps bringing people to the Island who also can't 'let go' thinking that would be most like him, so a good one to take over his "job".
@SG, maybe the clothing had something to do with the fact that MiB and Crazy Lady were supposed to be immortal? Or, maybe because Smokey inhabited them at different points?
SG, anyone with working vision can see that Sawyer is special.. ROFL!!
To add to my last thought, the real candidate will be the one who can't let go of the demons in his head. If they all find their redemption, their way out of the past to be able to move forward, then hopefully they'll all get out alive and the Island will sink with a vision of the black smoke rising.. LOST boom! The End! lol!
Hey LoCos!
Just caught up with all the comments. LOL. Apologies in advance for what will likely be a long post.
Darlton told us we'd get answers, and we did. Allison Janney was incredible (as always), though I really wasn't sure we should take Damon's tweet seriously.
The ep was amazing, overall. It seemed like Janney spoke latin with an American accent, but then I guess we can't really know what an "accurate" accent would have been for those ancient times.
I noticed that they started with subtitles, then a Universal Translator like effect took over (for our benefit), like with Hurley/Isabella.
The Allison Janney character wasn't exactly crazy. I guess there was some method to her madness. Like a lot of you I saw that rock to Claudia's head and MIB stabbing Mom coming.
It took a couple scenes in those caves for me to realize they were our LOSTies caves. But once that hit me and we saw MIB leave, I figured MIB/Mom may be Adam and Eve.
I could, however, have done entirely without those little flashback to our LOSTies finding Adam/Eve as Jacob layed out MIB/Mom/stones. That was probably for the benefit of the less "hardcore" fans, but meh.
As Ginger said, the wine seemed more ritualistic and Mom chanted too. But Jacob gave Richard wine from that flask -- and JT,I too recall that was after Richard says he wants to live but BEFORE Richard asks to live forever.
It's interesting that young MIB (BIB) could see dead people. Do some Candidates just have that power or is it somehow "given" to them? Does that mean anything for Hurley?
When they were 13, Jacob believed Mom's "They come, they fight...it always ends the same" and BIB was the one who didn't. Yet, by the time they grew up, Jacob/MIB had switched viewpoints.
Capcom -- Someone probably protected that light before Mom and would have turned over that duty to her, as she did with Jacob. Not sure if Mom drank that wine or is that was something she added to the ritual.
LostIt is correct in saying that the hole Mom knocked MIB unconscious in was closed up, possibly imploded. As you said above, Smokey must have instructed later Island comers on how to build the Wheel DHARMA found at the Orchid site.
Seems as if Mom Purged all of MIB's peeps when she learned they found a way to access the Light. So it's possible Jacob actually did order the Purge, maybe because DHARMA had completed the Orchid and began TT experiments?
As Olessi said, MIB died all those years ago. Jacob took his brother's body back to the cave...but he didn't bury him. Smokey seems to have the knowledge of the person he takes his human form from, but beyond that, what Smokey IS remains unknown.
I would have preferred if Jacob had taken MIB to the stream/Light and given him a choice of entering instead of throwing him into the stream in anger -- letting his brother choose that end.
In HOTRS, Jack said:
Long. It takes 40 or 50 years for clothing to degrade like this.
I guess that could be interpreted as "at least 40-50 years" though there's a huge difference between 40-50 yrs and 1000's. While the caves would have sheltered the bodies against environmental effects, I'm not sure the cloth would have lasted at all. So maybe some Island age-preventing/protecting there too?
@Ob, you make an excellent point about the Latin. I totally forgot that this all would have been in Latin. Wonder when Jacob learned English.
AL, that works out good, that the skeletons still had clothing and Jack guessed that they were about 40 years old. So, by not burying the bodies of 'Mother' and MIB, smokey was able to inhabit their bodies (like we know he's done with some of our dead Losties). Do we think Jack might have been off by a little less than 10 years and the 'incident' in 1977 correlates to when the bodies from the caves weren't used anymore and smokey was trapped in Jacob's cabin?
BS, Sawyer is definitely special! Especially wihtout a shirt! LOL
You've got that right, Lostit!
ObFuSc8 said...
When they were 13, Jacob believed Mom's "They come, they fight...it always ends the same" and BIB was the one who didn't. Yet, by the time they grew up, Jacob/MIB had switched viewpoints.
Great point! But what does it mean?! I think my brain just exploded.. LOL!
Stolen comment from TWoP:
I felt like I was watching that episode of Seinfeld where Jerry can't remember Mulva's name. "Goodbye, Mother." "Goodbye... you." -StellaMD
Ob
Good point about the purge. The Army was purged too. Seems like everytime someone gets close to using the light they're purged although it seemed the DI used the light more than once. I wonder why it took them so long to decide to purge the DI.
1. the energy inside the island is like the ring from lord of the rings. It takes a really pure guy like jacob to not succumb to the evil it inspires. She always knew jacob would be her replacement
2. Jacob's adoptive mother let the hunters get do all the work on the donkey wheel before she put a stop to it. Just like jacob let dharma do their thing in order to have the orchid built and thus more control over the island energy.
3. MIB may have conned other island people into finishing the donkey wheel
4. She let mib stay alive because she need to replace herself and smokey. She made it sound like she has seen others get greedy for the light and become part of smokey
5. adam and eves bones were only like 40 years old in 2004. So island time is very wacked out.
6. i think she had the plan for mib to kill her from the beginning when they came. Perhaps the light in small doses lets you mind time flash to see the future.
7 the blade was always in the backgammon box and she gave it to mib so he could kill her one day.
8 the kill them with this blade before they can speak came from mib killing her before she could speak. Jacob didn't know about it til richard because he wasn't there.
9. mib is already implanted with the rules because of his specialness
10. mib knows about the future from going into the light.
11. The mom was happy to be able to die
12. mib wants to go back and prevent his bio mom from dying
13. Jacob and mib have reversed roles, mib quotes the mom and jacob wants to trust people. Mib is trying to prove the mom right and jacob is trying to prove her wrong.
14. She obviously meant that the one kid becoming the smoke and jacob becoming her is how they could never hurt each other.
15. mib is stuck as locke now because locke is the new mib. I bet if they were to throw locke's body into the light he would become a separate smoke monster or gain full control of the smoke like mib seems to have. Locke's body needs to be there to get free when he throws the body in there.
16. locke needed to kill his own dad to qualify to be smokey not jacob. Ben may also become the new smokey, The new candidate needs to be crowned before this can happen, so flocke is trying to expedite the process to get his replacement in place. Perhaps why mib hasn't killed ben yet because he doesn't want to lose control of smokey yet. Perhaps killing jacob is what will let ben qualify like mib.
jacob brings special people to the island to replace smokey not himself. He try to pick a non-special do-gooder to replace himself. If janney wasn't the original protector, there was probably a smoke monster nemasis that she had that the boys never saw.
sayid became evil because of the water. A little bit of the temple water just heals you or keeps you young, but too much makes you evil like the light
I just rememberes when Locke was first dragged into the hole by Smokey and Jack and CO, ,pukled him out, he said that what he saw was the most beautiful light. Did he see THE light? The one Jacob is supposed to be protecting?
i think the scientific type slant on the light is that it's a white hole. All the backwards stuff and inverse wounds and camera shots seems to point this way too. A white hole in theory is where stuff sucked into a a black hole gets popped out. Time in a white hole runs reverse to time in a black hole. Perhaps the technological side of smokey like the scanning is actually from the distant future getting shot out the white hole in the past. SMokey knows about all of time and the end of the world because he went to the future when he went in the hole.
Wow, I just re-read my last post and I really need to use the spell checker. Please excuse my poor typing.
Well, we certainly did get one solid answer with Adam and Eve's identity!
Just some random thoughts (trying not to think too hard):
I assume that whatever Smokey really is required a body to "release" it. And by not burying his brother, Jacob left a dead body conveniently lying around to take over. One would think it would be totally weird to keep seeing your "brother" through the centuries knowing it's really Smokey.
And who gave Mom her power to protect the island? And how long has she been there?
It does seem that whenever any group of people get too close to the truth of the island they get purged (Claudia's people, the US Army, Dharma). Still brings up the question who are the "original inhabitants" that Ben joins (The Hostiles according to Dharma.) They knew a lot about the truth of the island's powers and they weren't purged.
So there really isn't any MIB anymore? Smokey is the real evil that can't be allowed to leave the island.
Hi all. Very interesting episode to say the least! I always knew they would reveal the truth of Adam and Eve.
I think we are being too quick to assume that Smokey is simply using MiBs form. Given that MiB and Jacobs mother told them that she had made it so they couldn't hurt each other (I'm guessing that only prevents killing as they obvious did hurt each other) and that is something Jacob and Smokey seemed to share it could be because Smokey is MiB. There is nothing that says because MiBs body is dead that he is actually dead. He could have simply become the Smoke Monster, with the body being discarded. Truth is we don't know either way but I see three facts that favour him being Jacobs brother (1. He couldn't harm Jacob; 2. He seems to have the same motivation and determination to leave the island; and 3. He talked about his mother being insane) and only one hinting at him being a different entity that simply used the body as a form to manifest itself (That taking on the form of a body left on the island is consistent with what we know Smokey can do).
Actually, thinking about Smokey's ability to do that and that we now know at least two people on the island (potential candidates?) were able to see dead people, I am wondering about Ben seeing his mother. As far as we know her body was never on the island, so Smokey in theory couldn't appear in her form. So perhaps Ben had that ability and was a candidate at that point (perhaps he stopped being a candidate when he was taken to the temple to be healed).
Anyway, I will probably have more comments soon but need to think about it all.
Fenris-that is my feeling too-that Smokey is still mostly Brother-though certainly reborn and changed some.
About MIB's name- my sister has a cat named Kitty. Maybe brother is just Brother because the real mother only had one name picked out?
Interesting to think if Jacob is doing things differently than his "Mother". She says to him="you don't really have a choice" about taking over. Jacob at least tells people they can choose-though whether that's true is debatable-well it's sure been debated!
question- how did "Mother" keep the light hidden from MIB for 30 years as he wandered the island-it's not that big. How did Jacob not find it for that matter-it couldn't have been that far away from camp since Jacob dragged MIB to it. If she could hide it somehow- why blindfold the kids to take them to it?
@JT, the same way Jacob kept his lighthouse from pretty much everyone ever? :)
AL-good thought- ok-still -how? Jedi mind tricks perhaps- "there's no golden deadly glow here-you want to move on-"
We know that Smokey inherits some of the traits of the person he's taking the form of.
So is MIB we know of today really the MIB who was the human brother to Jacob and just in smoke form? Or is it some unknown force that came out of the white light, and has some of human MIBs traits?
Was the fake mom of jacob/mib a smoke monster when mib killed her?
And whats up with the MIB body being found in the stream nearby after the smoke monster shot out of the lighthole? So we are to believe his real body got shoved into the white hole by Jacob, then the new smoke monster comes out with MIB traits...and his old human form got spit up over in the stream?
So many questions.
the light is like the lighthouse only certain people can find it.
i think janney may have very well been the jacob and the smoke
TWO SOURCE COSMOGONY: The One was and was-not, combined, and desired to separate the was-not from the was. So it generated a diploid sac which contained, like an eggshell, a pair of twins, each an androgyny, spinning in opposite directions (the Yin and Yang of Taoism, with the One as the Tao). The plan of the One was that both twins would emerge into being (was-ness) simultaneously; however, motivated by a desire to be (which the One implanted in both twins), the counter-clockwise twin broke through the sac and separated prematurely; i.e. before full term. This was the dark or Yin twin. Therefore it was defective. At full term the wiser twin emerged. Each twin formed a unitary entelechy, a single living organism made of psyche and soma, still rotating in opposite directions to each other. The full term twin, called Form I by Parmenides, advanced correctly through its growth stages, but the prematurely born twin, called Form II, languished.
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